Test Wiki:Community portal: Difference between revisions

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{{shortcut|TW:CP|TW:COM}}


==Proposal==
==Alternate proposal: Merging CheckUser and oversight to steward==
{{Discussion top|Per consensus, steward group now has <code>checkuser-log</code> and <code>supressionlog</code>. [[User:MacFan4000|MacFan4000]] <sup>([[User talk:MacFan4000|Talk]] [[Special:Contributions/MacFan4000|Contribs]])</sup> 18:58, 10 August 2023 (UTC)}}
Hello community! I’d like to propose an alternative to the proposal above about merging the rights. Here’s what I’d propose:
*Stewards are granted the suppression-log, view suppressed, and CheckUser-log rights for accountability;
*The CheckUser and Suppressor groups remain existent and aren’t removed;
This would allow for accountability amongst stewards and still allow non/stewards to be granted those rights if absolutely necessary. [[User:X|X]] ([[User talk:X|talk]]) 15:46, 26 June 2023 (UTC)


Hello, I happy to here to discuss on my new proposal to make a mediawikipage for this [[User:Aviram7/js/all-in-one.js|this]] JavaScript that help to easily block and oversight or suppress the revision of block user, spammers. etc, this script is originally based on [[metawikimedia:User:WhitePhosphorus/js/all-in-one.js|User:WhitePhosphorus/js/all-in-one.js]] of metawikimedia, but this script needed to modified them, then it's script ready for use on Tesrwiki.
:{{support}} - That seems like a good and better proposal, which is why I withdrew my proposal. [[User:Drummingman|Drummingman]] ([[User talk:Drummingman|talk]]) 15:20, 27 June 2023 (UTC)
:{{Support}} [[User:AlPaD|AlPaD]] ([[User talk:AlPaD|talk]]) 15:28, 27 June 2023 (UTC)
:{{support}} as proposer. [[User:X|X]] ([[User talk:X|talk]]) 20:58, 27 June 2023 (UTC)
:{{oppose}} viewsuppressed as it poses a confidentiality risk, {{support}} the rest. [[User:Zippybonzo|Zippybonzo]] ([[User talk:Zippybonzo|talk]]) 07:14, 28 June 2023 (UTC)
::Could you elaborate what you mean by “confidentiality risk”? @[[User:Drummingman|Drummingman]] requested I add “view suppressed” to list via Discord, so you may want to discuss with him. [[User:X|X]] ([[User talk:X|talk]]) 11:17, 28 June 2023 (UTC)
:::The reason I want to include view suppressed is that the logs already show a (partially) suppressed version, but to check each other properly you need view suppressed, and otherwise you have to add suppression yourself. The rest has to do with trusting the stewards to keep suppressed versions secret, which hopefully is already the case. [[User:Drummingman|Drummingman]] ([[User talk:Drummingman|talk]]) 13:21, 28 June 2023 (UTC)
::::What's wrong with adding the rights in that case? I don't view that as a significant imposition, and it aids public and community transparency. [[User:Dmehus|Dmehus]] ([[User talk:Dmehus|talk]]) 16:32, 1 July 2023 (UTC)
:::::I don't think you should be able to just view suppressed revisions without the community knowing. [[User:Zippybonzo|Zippybonzo]] ([[User talk:Zippybonzo|talk]]) 10:43, 2 July 2023 (UTC)
:{{support}}: per proposer. Whether non-stewards should be granted CU or SU is a question I will pose in another proposal if this one succeeds. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 13:49, 28 June 2023 (UTC)
:{{Oppose}} per [[User:Zippybonzo|Zippybonzo]]. [[User:Dmehus|Dmehus]] ([[User talk:Dmehus|talk]]) 16:29, 1 July 2023 (UTC)
::So would you support it without view suppressed? [[User:X|X]] ([[User talk:X|talk]]) 16:33, 1 July 2023 (UTC)
:::Yes. There does seem to be unanimous [[w:WP:CON|consensus]] here to at least <code>checkuser-log</code> being added. [[User:Dmehus|Dmehus]] ([[User talk:Dmehus|talk]]) 22:16, 2 July 2023 (UTC)
:{{Neutral}} - CU and SU practice for bureaucrats are optional, but I don't mind with CU and SU remain existent and not removed and steward having the CU and SU rights. [[User:Tailsultimatefan3891|Tailsultimatefan3891]] ([[User talk:Tailsultimatefan3891|talk]]) ([[Special:Contributions/Tailsultimatefan3891|contribs]]) ([[Special:UserRights/Tailsultimatefan3891|rights]]) ([[Special:Block/Tailsultimatefan3891|block]]) 23:47, 1 July 2023 (UTC)


*I think [[User:Aviram7/js/all-in-one.js]] is move to mediawiki namespace, then add this script in gadget and allow to sysop, crats, stewards for use on you're preferences.
===Possible close?===
[[User:Drummingman|Drummingman]], [[User:AlPaD|AlPaD]], [[User:X|X]], [[User:Zippybonzo|Zippybonzo]], [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]], and [[User:Tailsultimatefan3891|Tailsultimatefan3891]], I'm involved, and though I am fairly certain there would be no objections to me closing in this way, I thought I'd {{tl|ping}} you all here to receive your assent to this being closed as follows, as '''successful''' with '''<code>checkuser-log</code> added to the <code>[[Test Wiki:Stewards|steward]]</code>''' group and all other user groups remaining the same? [[User:Dmehus|Dmehus]] ([[User talk:Dmehus|talk]]) 21:52, 2 July 2023 (UTC)
<!--- Sign below this line if supportive --->
:I agree. [[User:Drummingman|Drummingman]] ([[User talk:Drummingman|talk]]) 22:56, 2 July 2023 (UTC)
:I agree [[User:Zippybonzo|Zippybonzo]] ([[User talk:Zippybonzo|talk]]) 05:09, 3 July 2023 (UTC)
:I agree. [[User:AlPaD|AlPaD]] ([[User talk:AlPaD|talk]]) 15:39, 3 July 2023 (UTC)
:Filed pull request. So {{partially done}} [[User:Zippybonzo|Zippybonzo]] ([[User talk:Zippybonzo|talk]]) 13:33, 18 July 2023 (UTC)
{{Discussion bottom}}


{{Ping|MacFan4000|Dmehus|Drummingman|Justarandomamerican}}
==Potential RfS candidate==
Thanks ~~ <span style="background-color:magenta; padding: 2px 5px 1px 5px">[[User:Aviram7|<span style="color:white">αvírαm</span>]]<nowiki>|</nowiki>[[User talk:Aviram7|(tαlk)]]</span> 08:36, 9 April 2024 (UTC)


:I would be fine with adding this as a gadget, but not on the common.js. [[User:X|'''<span style="background:#3383ff;color:white;padding:5px;box-shadow:0 1px 1px 0 rgba(0,0,0,0.2)">X</span>''']] ([[User talk:X|talk]] + [[Special:Contributions/X|contribs]]) 10:10, 9 April 2024 (UTC)
Hello. I'm considering running for Stewardship sometime in the near future. I would be assisted greatly by the Steward tools, given that my main edits and logged actions consist of preventing abuse.
I also think the community needs another Steward due to the fact that we have 3 Stewards, and only 1 is fully active, and a person cannot manage every Steward-reserved matter by themselves. I would add additional coverage to spot and prevent complex disruption, such as by [[Wikipedia:WP:CIR|users who lack the skills necessary to edit]]. My question is, what does the community think? Add feedback here in the Survey section below. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 01:30, 4 July 2023 (UTC)


::{{Ping|X}} Hello, Well! we have no probelm, If you like more gadgets for use, please see my common. js and this gadget is very helpful, firstly please test this js and then we think what can I do later?.
===Survey===
I would support. You have handled your tools well here and on other wikis, and are trustworthy. [[User:Piccadilly|Piccadilly]] ([[Special:Contribs/Piccadilly|<span style="color:red">My Contribs</span>]] | [[Special:Newsection/User talk:Piccadilly|<span style="color:#0080ff">Talk to me</span>]]) 01:32, 4 July 2023 (UTC)
Thanks ~~ <span style="background-color:magenta; padding: 2px 5px 1px 5px">[[User:Aviram7|<span style="color:white">αvírαm</span>]]<nowiki>|</nowiki>[[User talk:Aviram7|(tαlk)]]</span> 12:41, 9 April 2024 (UTC)


:This gadget would likely need to be restricted to stewards due to just how powerful it is. Being able to revert all of a users edits, delete all the pages they've created, and block them in one click is simply a lot. [[User:X|'''<span style="background:#3383ff;color:white;padding:5px;box-shadow:0 1px 1px 0 rgba(0,0,0,0.2)">X</span>''']] ([[User talk:X|talk]] + [[Special:Contributions/X|contribs]]) 18:40, 9 April 2024 (UTC)
I would not have any opposition to a potential run at some point in the near- to medium-term future. I would just recommend you articulate a clear need, invite questions from the community, and, perhaps, provide several situation-based examples to which you would articulate how you would handle those situations. As a [[Test Wiki:Stewards|Steward]] and an administrator of such elections, I will refrain from an expressing a view and stay neutral, so as to be impartial in any potential close. [[User:Dmehus|Dmehus]] ([[User talk:Dmehus|talk]]) 01:38, 4 July 2023 (UTC)


:::X, You're right this js script is very powerful Use of this JavaScript should only be allowed by stewards and not allowed to use by any other privileged persons. ~~ <span style="background-color:magenta; padding: 2px 5px 1px 5px">[[User:Aviram7|<span style="color:white">αvírαm</span>]]<nowiki>|</nowiki>[[User talk:Aviram7|(tαlk)]]</span> 03:56, 10 April 2024 (UTC)
:“With Drummingman's recent election to Steward, they are quite active here. Combined with my own resumption of being semi-active here, as well as MacFan4000, I feel there isn't a sufficient need for an additional Steward.” How is that different here? “I am not comfortable granting restricted permissions to someone I don't know, at least not without some on-wiki confirmation that they've held restricted tools on a Wikimedia, Miraheze, Fandom, or other major wiki or wiki farm. For Test Wiki is a recent launch, initiated as a protest wiki by one user who took issue with the way Public Test Wiki and/or Test Wiki are run. I do not consider holding restricted permissions on For Test Wiki to be sufficient demonstration that the user can be trusted.” How is that different either @[[User:Dmehus|Dmehus]]? [[User:X|X]] ([[User talk:X|talk]]) 01:45, 4 July 2023 (UTC)
::The former: I have articulated a need for Stewards based on activity, as well as an individual need for the tools. The latter: I'm Justarandomamerican on Miraheze and Wikimedia, and collaborated with Dmehus on Miraheze. Note that this comment are my thoughts on the matter, not his. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 02:06, 4 July 2023 (UTC)
::::I've commented it out of your common.js page for the moment, as it could cause some serious mayhem if used improperly. Ask me if you need a test performed. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 14:42, 10 April 2024 (UTC)
:::I know, but @[[User:Dmehus|Dmehus]] has expressed that he doesn’t think we need another steward, so I’m asking for clarification. [[User:X|X]] ([[User talk:X|talk]]) 02:16, 4 July 2023 (UTC)
::::I said I think it would need to be well-articulated on what the requesting user plans to do. While ideally some sort of global role would be nice to demonstrate the user is trusted, I actually thought Justarandomamerican was a Wikimedia Global Rollbacker, but I think I was thinking of JavaHurricane, with whom I've also collaborated on Miraheze and Public Test Wiki. IMHO, it [rfc:2119 ''should''] be some sort of local or global role on Miraheze, Wikimedia, or Fandom that demonstrates the user is sufficiently ''trusted''. For Wikimedia, it can probably be a ''local'' role, whereas on Miraheze, I'd say either a Miraheze Meta Wiki local role, Public Test Wiki Consul, or a Miraheze global role (other than global IP block exemption). For Fandom, it should be a Fandom global community or staff role. Hope that clarifies. :) [[User:Dmehus|Dmehus]] ([[User talk:Dmehus|talk]]) 02:23, 4 July 2023 (UTC)
:::::I'm not a global rollbacker on WM as I have no need for that right at the moment, but I am an enwiki and simplewiki local rollbacker. I'm relatively trusted to prevent abuse. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 02:27, 4 July 2023 (UTC)
I would weak oppose, as you aren't super trusted on wikimedia, and there isn't a need, though I would consider supporting if you held a higher trust role on wikimedia (i.e template editor, massmessage sender, new pages reviewer, edit filter helper, page mover, file mover, autopatrol), or a high trust global role, as I'd rather see some form of trustworthy role, as rollback isn't that highly sanctioned. [[User:Zippybonzo|Zippybonzo]] ([[User talk:Zippybonzo|talk]]) 07:13, 4 July 2023 (UTC)


::::::@[[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] Hello, Thank you for removing this script from my common. js, I've already performed the after adding this script on my common. js, I think this js script is more useful for the stewards. {{thanks}} ~~ <span style="background-color:magenta; padding: 2px 5px 1px 5px">[[User:Aviram7|<span style="color:white">αvírαm</span>]]<nowiki>|</nowiki>[[User talk:Aviram7|(tαlk)]]</span> 15:21, 10 April 2024 (UTC)
:The supposedly higher trust roles you describe are for a need and competency in entirely different areas: I'm not experienced enough to be a template editor, have no need to be a mass message sender, NPR is a user group assisting in dealing with content, not conduct, etc. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 13:15, 4 July 2023 (UTC)
::That makes sense. I’d say wait. Given that my RfS just failed with multiple people expressing that they don’t think a 4th steward is needed at all. [[User:X|X]] ([[User talk:X|talk]]) 13:27, 4 July 2023 (UTC)
:::Well, there appears to be, given the fact that there are only 3 Stewards and only 1 is fully active. I plan on waiting a bit anyways. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 13:39, 4 July 2023 (UTC)
::Well, there are plenty of roles that aren't for an explicit need, they show you can be trusted, you have 2500 edits on wikimedia, which isn't very many, and I'd rather you had higher trust levels on other wikis. [[User:Zippybonzo|Zippybonzo]] ([[User talk:Zippybonzo|talk]]) 19:00, 5 July 2023 (UTC)
:::How is making 2500 edits not very many? [[Wikipedia:Wikipedia:Wikipedians#User permissions|Only 30% of registered Wikipedia users ever make one.]] [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 19:39, 5 July 2023 (UTC)
::::I've got around 6000 which isn't very many, I'd expect more like 7500. [[User:Zippybonzo|Zippybonzo]] ([[User talk:Zippybonzo|talk]]) 15:49, 8 July 2023 (UTC)
:::::I was inviting you to explain why that isn't enough, as that's more than [[Wikipedia:Wikipedia:Wikipedians#User permissions|99.5% of all registered contributors]], and I am seeking the position for an individual need for tools to prevent abuse. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 15:56, 8 July 2023 (UTC)
::::::You don’t have a need for the tools, you have full access to the suite of admin tools which is enough to prevent abuse. I’m simply saying, that rollback isn’t that high trust, as they give it out to anyone who has a history of anti vandalism and meets the requirements, and 2500 edits is more than most users, but for a right giving access to look at IP addresses, I’d expect more trust on other wikis when the right isn’t entirely required. [[User:Zippybonzo|Zippybonzo]] ([[User talk:Zippybonzo|talk]]) 12:50, 9 July 2023 (UTC)
:::::::I could say that nobody actually requires the tools. Dmehus doesn't actually have a ''need'' to look up IPs, but was given the toolkit anyways. Cross-wiki trust barely matters in a small community, or even a large one. Nobody judges a scowiki admin candidate on the basis that they only have rollback on enwiki. Nobody judges an enwiki admin for only having rollback and patroller on metamiraheze. Why is this required when I have a track record right here of making perfectly fine decisions? Simply put: if a candidate has a track record of making good decisions on the wiki they are requesting permissions, they are trusted, even if they have a bit lower trust elsewhere. Rollback on enwiki? Sure, it's a bit lower trust, but it does add to a case of a totality of the circumstances trustworthiness, which I say exists based on my track record here and elsewhere. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 00:41, 10 July 2023 (UTC)
::::::::IMO a few of your decisions are far from good, which is why I’d want a right on another wiki that needs you to make good decisions. You still have no need for the right though, as there is 1 active steward, 1 semi-active steward, and a rarely active steward. [[User:Zippybonzo|Zippybonzo]] ([[User talk:Zippybonzo|talk]]) 02:34, 10 July 2023 (UTC)
:::::::::Please point me to a diff of a poor decision I made so that I can improve. A semi-active steward and one rarely active steward? That's why I'm requesting, there needs to be at least a duo of active stewards to handle any requests, as 1 person who is active isn't enough in any circumstance involving CU evidence, LTAs, and other forms of abuse that cannot be combated with the admin toolkit alone. People need other people to ask for review actively, not just a pair of semi-active stewards.[[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 03:39, 10 July 2023 (UTC)
::::::::::No, I also said an active steward as well, they are enough, the decision that was not great IMO was on FTW when you and X decided to take away IP privacy from abusive users, I’m not going to use it against you as I heavily doubt that you came up with the idea of it, but, there are a few conditions under which I’d support stewardship.
::::::::::If any of the following conditions are met.
::::::::::#The wiki grows to the point where MacFan, Dmehus and Drummingman can’t prevent abuse.
::::::::::#You are more highly trusted on other wikis (not test ones or ones that just give out high trust permissions).
::::::::::#You show that you can perform actions similar to steward actions without significant opposition.
::::::::::However IMO, 1 is so close to being met, that I’d probably support. Though I do consider this discussion to be pre discussion canvassing, you are a pretty highly qualified candidate, who inevitably I would have to support. [[User:Zippybonzo|Zippybonzo]] ([[User talk:Zippybonzo|talk]]) 06:37, 10 July 2023 (UTC)
:::::::::::Relating to the privacy policy change, if you had a problem with the change, you should’ve said so in the waiting time before the policy took effect. I don’t consider this to be canvassing, given that they weren’t asking for support and it’s all public. I was looking on Wikipedia and it appears to be similar to [[wikipedia:Wikipedia:Requests for adminship/Optional RfA candidate poll]]. [[User:X|X]] ([[User talk:X|talk]]) 10:56, 10 July 2023 (UTC)
::::::::::::I did air the concern but it was ignored. [[User:Zippybonzo|Zippybonzo]] ([[User talk:Zippybonzo|talk]]) 11:48, 10 July 2023 (UTC)
:::::::::::::I believe your concern was addressed by compromise: We replaced IP addresses with ranges, which are vague as to specific location, and cannot be used to identify 1 person in particular. I understand the concern about privacy, but some form of amendment was required to prevent disruption, and immediately after your feedback I realized that blocking IP addresses may not be the best way to go about preventing disruption from sockpuppetry, so now the PP allows for range blocks of CU-found IPs, not specific ones like was originally planned by X. I used rather vague wording whilst discussing the topic of preventing disruption from sockpuppetry, resulting in a privacy concern. My apologies. I certainly didn't mean for specific IPs to be blocked. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 14:42, 10 July 2023 (UTC)


==Replace text==
==Amend [[Test Wiki:No open proxies]] to include [[Wikipedia: colocation providers|colocation providers]]==
I've used it a lot in the past, and it saved a lot of time. But as of now, it's restricted to <u>stewards</u>. Why's that? [[User:Jody|Saint]] ([[User talk: Jody|talk]]) 04:43, 10 April 2024 (UTC)


Colocation providers also hide IPs, like proxies and webhosts, so they should logically be included. Change: "No open proxies, web hosts, or VPNs..." to "No open proxies, web hosts, VPNs, or [[Wikipedia:Colocation providers|colocation providers]]..." [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 18:45, 5 July 2023 (UTC)
:It was found that a vandal who gained sysop rights could vandalize the [[Main Page]] or similarly important Steward protected pages using ReplaceText. I know it has a lot of utility for you, so feel free to send me a message on my talk page, or Drummingman on his with a request, ensuring that original text, new text, and namespace(s) are provided. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 12:53, 10 April 2024 (UTC)
::Is it possible to allow interface administrators to use it? [[User:X|'''<span style="background:#3383ff;color:white;padding:5px;box-shadow:0 1px 1px 0 rgba(0,0,0,0.2)">X</span>''']] ([[User talk:X|talk]] + [[Special:Contributions/X|contribs]]) 13:16, 10 April 2024 (UTC)
:::I suggested that to MacFan when I originally opened a security task about the issue. Me personally, I think it would be better to create a separate group that's able to use it, as IA is ''primarily'' intended to allow editing of script pages, though I am fine with bundling it in to IA (and Stewards) along with creating a separate group. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 13:19, 10 April 2024 (UTC)


=='Crat sysop first requirement==
:{{done}} as this is pretty uncontroversial and doesn’t warrant further discussion. [[User:X|X]] ([[User talk:X|talk]]) 16:21, 8 July 2023 (UTC)


{{ping|EPIC|X|DR}} as interested persons.
==Addition of interface admin protection level==
Recently, upon DR requesting bureaucrat, they were given it without first being an administrator. EPIC removed the crat right, and X restored it, stating that the requirement was pointless. To prevent a wheel war, I think it's best to set down community consensus on the issue. What do you, the reader, think of the requirement to be a sysop before being a bureaucrat? [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 03:33, 11 April 2024 (UTC)


:@[[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]]: I've support you're thoughts, This is test wiki not Wikipedia, we are here to testing of specific permission, firstly If any new user request for both rights, then firstly grant only sysop permission but not crats, because sysop have more permission on his group, crats is most important permission on the wiki, I don't understand why both user's make editwar in removing or adding crats permission from @DR, who received both permission after reviewing his request by an other crats. ~~ <span style="background-color:magenta; padding: 2px 5px 1px 5px">[[User:Aviram7|<span style="color:white">αvírαm</span>]]<nowiki>|</nowiki>[[User talk:Aviram7|(tαlk)]]</span> 04:24, 11 April 2024 (UTC)
I am proposing that interface administrator protection is added to help protect sensitive interface pages, i.e the sidebar and sitenotice pages, and also for protecting highly used templates. [[User:Zippybonzo|Zippybonzo]] ([[User talk:Zippybonzo|talk]]) 06:47, 10 July 2023 (UTC)
::I personally think that just like on other test wikis, there should some kind of requirement before being able to request crat, either an edit requirement (maybe something like 10 edits before being able to request bureaucrat would be a fair requirement if so?), or a requirement of a specific amount of days of having sysop before requesting crat (a day or two perhaps), or maybe a mix of both of those requirements.
*{{Oppose}}. [[User:X|X]] ([[User talk:X|talk]]) 11:13, 10 July 2023 (UTC)
::The reason I think so is because unlike on other test wikis, the crat permission is quite powerful and can remove both bureaucrat and sysop rights. If it's given very liberally it can be quite dangerous. Now, I know DR from Wikimedia and they are a trusted user who I certainly don't think would abuse the bureaucrat rights, so I have nothing against them having crat. But, I don't have any intents to wheel war, the permissions have been given back and it can remain so. [[User:EPIC|EPIC]] ([[User talk:EPIC|talk]]) 08:10, 11 April 2024 (UTC)
*:@[[User:X|X]] With what rationale? [[User:Zippybonzo|Zippybonzo]] ([[User talk:Zippybonzo|talk]]) 12:19, 10 July 2023 (UTC)
:::My intention was also not to wheel war. I know EPIC mentioned some suggestions for "requirements" for the 'crat role. However, as of now, those do not exist, making the rule about being a sysop first pointless. There is some Wikimedia essay about not following the policies if doing so would prevent you from improving the site, but I can't remember what it was titled. [[User:X|'''<span style="background:#3383ff;color:white;padding:5px;box-shadow:0 1px 1px 0 rgba(0,0,0,0.2)">X</span>''']] ([[User talk:X|talk]] + [[Special:Contributions/X|contribs]]) 11:51, 11 April 2024 (UTC)
:You can remove the bureaucrat right from my account since I won’t be using it. I have MediaWiki installed on my local machine for testing purposes, and I already have all the advanced rights there. Here on this test wiki, my goal is to assist others by deploying some important and useful scripts and translating help pages. Initially, I thought that crats have access to grant the interface admin right, but it appears they do not, so I no longer require this role. Could any Steward please grant the interface admin right to my account? I would like to deploy some useful gadgets. Also, for granting requirements, I believe granting the bureaucrat role should be discretionary. [[User:DR|DR]] ([[User talk:DR|talk]]) 09:52, 11 April 2024 (UTC)
:We should definitely set requirements for gaining crat. It is a powerful position, and any disruptive user can easily misuse it. Since EPIC knew DR , there would not be a problem, but if a random user came and requested sysop and crat, there is a chance of vandalism or disruption. I propose that a user must wait 24 hours and make 10 edits before requesting crat rights [[User:Harvici|<span style="font-family:Segoe print; color:#CC4E5C ; text-shadow:gray 0.2em 0.2em 0.4em;">Harvici</span>]] ([[User talk:Harvici|<span style="color:#228B22">''talk''</span>]]) 06:55, 12 April 2024 (UTC)
::It's not a terribly powerful position, since it's mostly a testing right, but that being said, it ''does'' require an extra degree of trust as it includes extra permissions like <code>nuke</code> and <code>import</code>, which ''can'' cause vandalism that is time consuming to revert if used by unscrupulous actors. Since Justarandomamerican initiated the discussion, I will contribute here and allow Drummingman or MacFan4000 to close. Your suggestion of 10 edits is a good one, but I'd also add a time requirement and would suggest a minimum of a four day wait ''unless'' the user previously held user rights here, then the waiting period requirement is waived. We could also add in an alternate pathway to waive the waiting period requirement, such has having a confirmation edit from a mainstream wiki farm (Wikimedia, Fandom, or Miraheze) and being a known user in good standing there. [[User:Dmehus|Dmehus]] ([[User talk:Dmehus|talk]]) 01:31, 27 April 2024 (UTC)


==Permission revocation request==
:*{{Oppose|Weak Oppose}} I don't see why bureaucrat/steward protection isn't enough, particularly for the sidebar.[[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 14:43, 10 July 2023 (UTC)
*{{Oppose|Weak oppose}} Per Justarandomamerican. [[User:AlPaD|AlPaD]] ([[User talk:AlPaD|talk]]) 08:14, 15 July 2023 (UTC)


Hello, I am currently suffering from high powerful stress which is impairing my ability to work on test wiki and elsewhere, hence, I request the admins of test wiki to please remove my sysop + crats permission on my account, I will try to come back and edit here. Thanks to all the editors of test wiki for giving me a chance to test the tools of sysop and crats and I hope I have not broken any rules and regulations of test wiki.. {{Thanks}} ~~ <span style="background-color:magenta; padding: 2px 5px 1px 5px">[[User:Aviram7|<span style="color:white">αvírαm</span>]]<nowiki>|</nowiki>[[User talk:Aviram7|(tαlk)]]</span> 04:40, 16 April 2024 (UTC)
==Block review of Piccadilly==


:{{done}} — You are free to reapply for user permissions when you return. [[User:Drummingman|Drummingman]] ([[User talk:Drummingman|talk]]) 08:52, 16 April 2024 (UTC)
I'd like to determine whether consensus believes that Piccadilly creating a blank talk page for a test page is worthy of a 3 month block from talk namespaces. In my opinion a block from talk namespaces is unneeded but instead a final warning, and a filter to warn upon creation of talk pages with a size under 256 bytes (a signature and a few words). For the record, this wiki is a test wiki, not the English Wikipedia, meaning people can test, and they aren't random talk pages, they are talk pages of test pages. [[User:Zippybonzo|Zippybonzo]] ([[User talk:Zippybonzo|talk]]) 11:16, 11 July 2023 (UTC)


==Interface Right==
:Or possibly limit the creation to exclude certain words (I.e hello, hi, guys), also, blocking at the request of a steward is mad, as the stewards can block for themselves, they are sysops too and I'd like to see their name in the block log if they authorised the block, as you don't see MacFan telling someone else to update the wiki. [[User:Zippybonzo|Zippybonzo]] ([[User talk:Zippybonzo|talk]]) 11:21, 11 July 2023 (UTC)
::{{oppose}} changing the block. We’ve given Piccadilly so many changes and so many warnings. Why must we give another? I think the partial block is a good alternative to a indef full block. And there’s nothing wrong with blocking on the request of a steward because maybe they can’t get to a laptop or they’re very busy. I’ve done it before and there’s nothing wrong with it. [[User:X|X]] ([[User talk:X|talk]]) 12:33, 11 July 2023 (UTC)
:::{{oppose}} changing the block as per [[User:X|X]]'s [[Special:Diff/28972|comment]]. [[User:Sav|Sav]] • ([[Special:Contribs/Sav|<span style="color:#0080ff"> Edits</span>]] | [[Special:Newsection/User talk:Sav|<span style="color:#0080ff">Talk </span>]]) 12:46, 11 July 2023 (UTC)
::::{{Comment}} -- The blockage was not entirely at my request, only the change from 1 year to three months was made by Justarandomamerican at my request. [[User:Drummingman|Drummingman]] ([[User talk:Drummingman|talk]]) 14:07, 11 July 2023 (UTC)
:::Totally reasonable that they can somehow tell you to do it but not access their computer, I don’t think that’s a very good reason. [[User:Zippybonzo|Zippybonzo]] ([[User talk:Zippybonzo|talk]]) 02:12, 12 July 2023 (UTC)
I'm neutral on the block, to be honest. I'm just glad it isn't an indefinite sitewide block. [[User:Piccadilly|Piccadilly]] ([[Special:Contribs/Piccadilly|<span style="color:red">My Contribs</span>]] | [[Special:Newsection/User talk:Piccadilly|<span style="color:#0080ff">Talk to me</span>]]) 12:51, 12 July 2023 (UTC)


Hello everyone, I try to re- modifying Twinkle tool for use, but I don't think Twinkle Tool are working on Test Wiki; If you like I like to fix Twinkle tool for working on Test Wiki, so, I needed, please grant me Interface right for permanently for successfully complete this work.{{thanks}} ~~ <span style="background-color:magenta; padding: 2px 5px 1px 5px">[[User:Aviram7|<span style="color:white">αvírαm</span>]]<nowiki>|</nowiki>[[User talk:Aviram7|(tαlk)]]</span> 16:46, 18 April 2024 (UTC)
:@[[User:Piccadilly|Piccadilly]] May I ask why you tested on talk pages again after many warnings? [[User:X|X]] ([[User talk:X|talk]]) 13:02, 12 July 2023 (UTC)
:I think that for the moment you can rework this script into personal subpages and we will see later about the rights because other interface admins will be able to add it as a gadget.[[User:DodoMan|DodoMan]] ([[User talk:DodoMan|talk]]) 16:57, 18 April 2024 (UTC)
::I'm not really sure to be honest. I can say that I wasn't thinking about possible consequences of my actions, which I know isn't an excuse. I think I need to make more of an effort to slow down and think about doing things rather than just rush into them like I tend to do. [[User:Piccadilly|Piccadilly]] ([[Special:Contribs/Piccadilly|<span style="color:red">My Contribs</span>]] | [[Special:Newsection/User talk:Piccadilly|<span style="color:#0080ff">Talk to me</span>]]) 13:54, 12 July 2023 (UTC)
::{{Ping|DodoMan}} Hello, Do you know Twinkle Tool are not currently available in gadgets section and it's subpages are not currently exist here, We recreating those pages and interface admin right are more help to edit and create js pages on Test Wiki.Cheers!~~ <span style="background-color:magenta; padding: 2px 5px 1px 5px">[[User:Aviram7|<span style="color:white">αvírαm</span>]]<nowiki>|</nowiki>[[User talk:Aviram7|(tαlk)]]</span> 17:04, 18 April 2024 (UTC)
===Alternate proposal: Prevent creation of talk pages but allow editing===
I have an alternative proposal, to use an edit filter to prevent creation of talk pages for the remainder of the block, but allow editing. Any tampering with the filter will result in a desysop and 6 month block from all namespaces. [[User:Zippybonzo|Zippybonzo]] ([[User talk:Zippybonzo|talk]]) 12:29, 14 July 2023 (UTC)
:::{{Ping|Aviram7}}Yes I know the tool it’s inavailable but you can rework script on your subpages. At worst, I will create these mediawiki pages and rework them with you. And also you need to request rights to Test Wiki:Request Permissions.[[User:DodoMan|DodoMan]] ([[User talk:DodoMan|talk]]) 17:17, 18 April 2024 (UTC)


:::{{ping|DodoMan}} That's Great! well I going to request for Interface permission on request page and try to creating twinkle subpages on userspace and I beleive our hard struggle will be positive result proved.~~ <span style="background-color:magenta; padding: 2px 5px 1px 5px">[[User:Aviram7|<span style="color:white">αvírαm</span>]]<nowiki>|</nowiki>[[User talk:Aviram7|(tαlk)]]</span> 17:33, 18 April 2024 (UTC)
:{{Neutral}}. [[User:X|X]] ([[User talk:X|talk]]) 12:40, 14 July 2023 (UTC)


::::I requested for Interface permission on [[TW:RfP]]. ~~ <span style="background-color:magenta; padding: 2px 5px 1px 5px">[[User:Aviram7|<span style="color:white">αvírαm</span>]]<nowiki>|</nowiki>[[User talk:Aviram7|(tαlk)]]</span> 17:40, 18 April 2024 (UTC)
:{{Support}} as the least restrictive method of preventing disruption at the moment. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 12:43, 14 July 2023 (UTC)


==Filter 120==
:{{Support}} [[User:Piccadilly|Piccadilly]] ([[Special:Contribs/Piccadilly|<span style="color:red">My Contribs</span>]] | [[Special:Newsection/User talk:Piccadilly|<span style="color:#0080ff">Talk to me</span>]]) 12:52, 14 July 2023 (UTC)
:{{Neutral}}. [[User:Sav|Sav]] • ([[Special:Contribs/Sav|<span style="color:#0080ff"> Edits</span>]] | [[Special:Newsection/User talk:Sav|<span style="color:#0080ff">Talk </span>]]) 15:31, 14 July 2023 (UTC)
:{{Support}} [[User:AlPaD|AlPaD]] ([[User talk:AlPaD|talk]]) 08:16, 15 July 2023 (UTC)
:I believe this can be implemented now, and anyone may remove the block as soon as it is implemented. If they edit existing talk pages to test editing functions, the block may be reinstated by any Bureaucrat. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 16:19, 17 July 2023 (UTC)
::Implementing... could take a while as I haven't used filters like this in a while. [[User:Zippybonzo|Zippybonzo]] ([[User talk:Zippybonzo|talk]]) 04:04, 18 July 2023 (UTC)
:::Should be done, give me a bit of time to test it and I'll be back with a full result. [[User:Zippybonzo|Zippybonzo]] ([[User talk:Zippybonzo|talk]]) 04:10, 18 July 2023 (UTC)
::::{{done}} [[User:Zippybonzo|Zippybonzo]] ([[User talk:Zippybonzo|talk]]) 04:25, 18 July 2023 (UTC)


I propose converting it to an abusive username prevention filter. Any objections? [[User:Codename Noreste|<span style="font-family:Verdana;color:#0024FF">'''''Codename Norte'''''</span>]] 🤔 [[User talk:Codename Noreste|<span style="color:#0a13ad">talk</span>]] 15:27, 25 April 2024 (UTC)
==Proposal: Non steward CheckUser & Oversight/Suppressors==
:Nope,is good for me.(oh no is my bot account)[[User:BotRafdodo|BotRafdodo]] ([[User talk:BotRafdodo|talk]]) 16:38, 25 April 2024 (UTC)~
:None. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 21:46, 25 April 2024 (UTC)
::Standby... writing the regex... [[User:Codename Noreste|<span style="font-family:Verdana;color:#0024FF">'''''Codename Norte'''''</span>]] 🤔 [[User talk:Codename Noreste|<span style="color:#0a13ad">talk</span>]] 02:16, 26 April 2024 (UTC)
:::and WHEW!!! {{done}}. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]], you might want to remove the account creation conditions from filter 92 since I implemented them to filter 120. [[User:Codename Noreste|<span style="font-family:Verdana;color:#0024FF">'''''Codename Norte'''''</span>]] 🤔 [[User talk:Codename Noreste|<span style="color:#0a13ad">talk</span>]] 03:31, 26 April 2024 (UTC)
::::Any objections if I set this to disallow? [[User:Codename Noreste|<span style="font-family:Verdana;color:#0024FF">'''''Codename Norte'''''</span>]] 🤔 [[User talk:Codename Noreste|<span style="color:#0a13ad">talk</span>]] 01:47, 27 April 2024 (UTC)
:::::LGTM. I'm not sure the likelihood of LTAs and blocked users trying to use variations of known usernames, but it can't hurt, either. [[User:Dmehus|Dmehus]] ([[User talk:Dmehus|talk]]) 02:36, 27 April 2024 (UTC)
:::::No, if there's a helpful message. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 22:10, 29 April 2024 (UTC)
::::::{{done}}. [[User:Codename Noreste|<span style="font-family:Verdana;color:#0024FF">'''''Codename Noreste'''''</span>]] 🤔 [[User talk:Codename Noreste|<span style="font-family:Verdana;color:#0A16A5">''La Suma''</span>]] 02:50, 30 April 2024 (UTC)


==Crat requirements's [[User:Harvici/Bureaucrat requirements|policy]]==
Hello, I am proposing non-steward check user and oversight/suppressors, whilst there isn't an active need for extra check users or suppressors as of now, in my opinion, if there are enough people able to perform the role, then they should be in the role as it's always better to have more people when you don't need them but to have none when you need them. Because the two roles are quite high trust, I am proposing the following requirements for each role.


As in the above discussion, I have established [[User:Harvici/Bureaucrat requirements|policy]]-related criteria for the CRT position, as previously stated by Dmehus, " {{talk quote inline|It's not [...] require an extra degree of trust as it includes extra permissions like nuke and import which can cause vandalism [...]}}. [[User:Harvici|<span style="font-family:Segoe print; color:#CC4E5C ; text-shadow:gray 0.2em 0.2em 0.4em;">Harvici</span>]] ([[User talk:Harvici|<span style="color:#228B22">''talk''</span>]]) 18:31, 27 April 2024 (UTC)
Checkuser:


===Adoption Discussion===
#Basic understanding of IP addresses and ranges and CIDR syntax.
As a policy, this would practically just codify community norms on how to grant crat rights. I propose (and support) adopting this as policy.
#Pass a vote on the community portal with either 80% support, or 70-80% at a steward's discretion.
#Have a good understanding of account security.
#Performing unnecessary or abusive checks will result in having your access revoked.


*{{support}} [[User:Harvici|<span style="font-family:Segoe print; color:#CC4E5C ; text-shadow:gray 0.2em 0.2em 0.4em;">Harvici</span>]] ([[User talk:Harvici|<span style="color:#228B22">''talk''</span>]]) 18:35, 27 April 2024 (UTC)
Suppressor:
*{{support|Conditional support}}: I'll support this with the modifications I have made. There should be some level of discretion granted to Stewards, as this is a test wiki, and trusted users should be able to bypass the requirements, along with Stewards being able to requalify a person. Otherwise, I'd say this is a reasonable security requirement. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 18:59, 27 April 2024 (UTC)
*{{Support|Conditional support}} The draft policy isn't ''exactly'' as I would've liked, but it's reasonable. Justarandomamerican's reason for additional, [[w:WP:COMMONSENSE|common sense]] exceptions by Stewards is also reasonable, and so I support that. It arguably goes without saying Stewards are able to do this anyway, but I support making this a conditional requirement for my support. [[User:Dmehus|Dmehus]] ([[User talk:Dmehus|talk]]) 19:12, 27 April 2024 (UTC)
*What do you guys think about Dmehus suggestion {{talk quote inline|to waive the waiting period requirement, such has having a confirmation edit from a mainstream wiki farm (Wikimedia, Fandom, or Miraheze) and being a known user in good standing there.}}Should we make a change with respect to this? [[User:Harvici|<span style="font-family:Segoe print; color:#CC4E5C ; text-shadow:gray 0.2em 0.2em 0.4em;">Harvici</span>]] ([[User talk:Harvici|<span style="color:#228B22">''talk''</span>]]) 02:07, 28 April 2024 (UTC)
*{{comment}} Changed the criteria from ''"must have been a registered user for a minimum of 4 days"'' to ''"must have been an'' '''administrator''''' for a minimum of 4 days"''As any user can ask for crat rights before they even get sysop (the registered criteria is also mentioned on the top) [[User:Harvici|<span style="font-family:Segoe print; color:#CC4E5C ; text-shadow:gray 0.2em 0.2em 0.4em;">Harvici</span>]] ([[User talk:Harvici|<span style="color:#228B22">''talk''</span>]]) 13:11, 29 April 2024 (UTC)
*:I'd prefer that, [[User:Harvici|Harvici]]. I would've preferred your language originally, but wasn't enough to cause me oppose the proposal. [[User:Dmehus|Dmehus]] ([[User talk:Dmehus|talk]]) 23:22, 29 April 2024 (UTC)
*{{oppose|Strong oppose}} How long has it been since someone has abused their bureaucrat permissions? Months, at least. This simply makes it harder for users to test, and as such, I oppose. [[User:X|'''<span style="background:#3383ff;color:white;padding:5px;box-shadow:0 1px 1px 0 rgba(0,0,0,0.2)">X</span>''']] ([[User talk:X|talk]] + [[Special:Contributions/X|contribs]]) 13:27, 29 April 2024 (UTC)
*:This isn't about adding revocation criteria, [[User:X|X]]. As it stands, if you're an existing bureaucrat, you meet the exception criteria to have the bit re-added without the waiting period requirement. I would, however, potentially suggest adding a requirement that the <code>bureaucrat</code> user group is limited to the user's main account only. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]], thoughts? [[User:Dmehus|Dmehus]] ([[User talk:Dmehus|talk]]) 23:24, 29 April 2024 (UTC)
*::I do suppose that ''could'' be added, but how would we handle legitimate test (such as testing the bureaucrat right on its own, without sysop) or cratbot accounts? [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 00:33, 30 April 2024 (UTC)


==Omnibus RfC: Unbundling abusefilter permissions from Administrators==
#Basic understanding of suppression criteria.
#Pass a vote on the community portal with either 80% support, or 70-80% at a steward's discretion.
#Have a good understanding of account security.


<del> I would like to propose all of the following: 1: Unbundle all abusefilter-related (excluding basic rights already included in <code>*</code> or <code>user</code>) from the sysop group.
I believe that this is also a way for users to gain additional trust.
2. Bundle these rights into the Steward group.
3. Create a new <code>abusefilter-edit</code> group with these rights, and a <code>abusefilter-helper</code> group with view-only access, both grantable by a Steward upon request.
Though this would be taking away a permission used by many, the AbuseFilter extension is a ''very'' powerful tool: There is the potential for evasion of restrictions imposed on specific users by the ability to view private filters, let alone the fact that a vandal that gets access to it could actually block innocent, or even potentially all edits. If this is implemented, I plan to grant the edit right to those who already work with our edit filters. </del> [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 21:43, 27 April 2024 (UTC) <small>withdrawn, see my comment below [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 22:00, 29 April 2024 (UTC)</small>


:This sounds good to me. Thanks for starting the RfC. I'd only suggest a small change, by allowing any <code>sysop</code> to ''view'' the abuse filters; they just wouldn't be able to ''edit'' them unless they have the <code>abusefilter-helper</code> group. I'd also suggest adding both a time-based inactivity requirement (something like 30-90 days) whereby someone not having used the permission in the given time period can lose the permission and also broad Steward discretion to remove the permission where it's either misused or no longer used recently. [[User:Dmehus|Dmehus]] ([[User talk:Dmehus|talk]]) 00:06, 28 April 2024 (UTC)
Being that the implementation of this could result in a lack of transparency with the community, I think that 2 additional groups should be added. These groups may not be added immediately,
::That sounds good to me. I only added the "view private filters" unbundle because with a bit of knowledge of the language of abuse filters, you could probably bypass a filter restricting you, but I suppose there isn't a problem with that ''yet''. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 00:22, 28 April 2024 (UTC)
:::{{comment}} I am not a sockpuppeteer or something, and I assist with abuse filters almost all the time, but is the abusefilter-edit group not allowed to have the abusefilter-modify-restricted because of the potential of actions that can impact actual users? [[User:Codename Noreste|<span style="font-family:Verdana;color:#0024FF">'''''Codename Norte'''''</span>]] 🤔 [[User talk:Codename Noreste|<span style="color:#0a13ad">talk</span>]] 03:20, 28 April 2024 (UTC)
::::I don't have strong feelings about that. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 03:55, 28 April 2024 (UTC)
:::::Should the abusefilter-edit group have the restricted action modifcation right, community consensus or similar is mandatory. [[User:Codename Noreste|Codename Noreste]] ([[User talk:Codename Noreste|talk]]) 03:59, 28 April 2024 (UTC)
:::::The <code>abusefilter-modify-restricted</code> user right is currently restricted to [[Test Wiki:Stewards|Stewards]] for mainly security and abuse reasons. I ''suppose'' we could sub-delegate this user right, but I'd rather see it be a ''separate'' user group, like <code>abusefilter-sysop</code> or something, that would also require a community vote (like non-Steward suppressors) (since it requires an extra degree of trust and also has some real, non-test administrator responsibilities). [[User:Dmehus|Dmehus]] ([[User talk:Dmehus|talk]]) 16:24, 28 April 2024 (UTC)
::::::I would propose all of the following in addition:
::::::*All admins should keep the abusefilter-log-detail right.
::::::*The <code>abusefilter-helper</code> group should only have the abusefilter-view-private and abusefilter-log-private permissions.
::::::*The <code>abusefilter-edit</code> group should just simply have the name <code>abusefilter</code>, and have the following rights (in addition to having a community vote requirement):
::::::1) Create or modify abuse filters (abusefilter-modify) [this may or may not need the two rights listed on the abusefilter-helper permission since this permission allows you to view the filters and their logs, whether public or private]
::::::2) Create or modify what external domains are blocked from being linked (abusefilter-modify-blocked-external-domains)
::::::3) Modify abuse filters with restricted actions (abusefilter-modify-restricted)
::::::4) Revert all changes by a given abuse filter (abusefilter-revert)
::::::*Stewards do not need to assign the abusefilter or abusefilter-helper permission to themselves, but they can assign and remove either of the two to trusted users following a community vote.
::::::[[User:Codename Noreste|<span style="font-family:Verdana;color:#0024FF">'''''Codename Noreste'''''</span>]] 🤔 [[User talk:Codename Noreste|<span style="font-family:Verdana;color:#0A16A5">''La Suma''</span>]] 17:27, 28 April 2024 (UTC)
:::::::A community vote and/or Steward discretion (for helper, or granting edit to those who have worked on abuse filters before) or consensus (for neither of those cases), I presume? Appointment by community vote only would be a higher bar than we set for our [[Test Wiki: Suppressors|non-steward suppressors]]. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 18:24, 28 April 2024 (UTC)
::::::::{{S|Conditional support}} per my comment above. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 18:25, 28 April 2024 (UTC)
:::::::::I am writing a proposed policy about the abuse filter and their proposed user rights; anyone can help. [[User:Codename Noreste|<span style="font-family:Verdana;color:#0024FF">'''''Codename Noreste'''''</span>]] 🤔 [[User talk:Codename Noreste|<span style="font-family:Verdana;color:#0A16A5">''La Suma''</span>]] 01:20, 29 April 2024 (UTC)
::::::::::{{S|Strong Support}} I support this proposal. ~~ <span style="background-color:magenta; padding: 2px 5px 1px 5px">[[User:Aviram7|<span style="color:white">αvírαm</span>]]<nowiki>|</nowiki>[[User talk:Aviram7|(tαlk)]]</span> 09:28, 29 April 2024 (UTC)
:::::::::::How long has it been since someone has abused abuse filter access? Months, years? I don't ever recall this being an issue. Like the above proposal, this simply makes it harder for users to test and I will always {{oppose|Strongly oppose}} that. [[User:X|'''<span style="background:#3383ff;color:white;padding:5px;box-shadow:0 1px 1px 0 rgba(0,0,0,0.2)">X</span>''']] ([[User talk:X|talk]] + [[Special:Contributions/X|contribs]]) 13:29, 29 April 2024 (UTC)
::::::::::::This also makes it extremely difficult to make small changes to abusefilters, or fix bugs. This is a solution looking for a problem, in addition to being extremely bureaucratic. Must I remind everyone that this is a testwiki, where people test tools like abusefilter? [[User:X|'''<span style="background:#3383ff;color:white;padding:5px;box-shadow:0 1px 1px 0 rgba(0,0,0,0.2)">X</span>''']] ([[User talk:X|talk]] + [[Special:Contributions/X|contribs]]) 17:09, 29 April 2024 (UTC)


::::::::::{{support|Strong Support }} I added a lot of content to the [[User:Codename Noreste/Abuse filter|policy]]; feel free to add your own suggestion :) [[User:Harvici|<span style="font-family:Segoe print; color:#CC4E5C ; text-shadow:gray 0.2em 0.2em 0.4em;">Harvici</span>]] ([[User talk:Harvici|<span style="color:#228B22">''talk''</span>]]) 14:49, 29 April 2024 (UTC)
:::::::::::{{oppose}} I haven't found any vandalism in the abuse filters so far. It seems unnecessary to make such a change when there is no vandalism. Therefore, I am opposing this proposal. [[User:LisafBia|LisafBia]] ([[User talk:LisafBia|talk]]) 17:16, 29 April 2024 (UTC)
:I now {{oppose|withdraw my proposal and oppose}} the policy proposal upon reading the two rational oppose comments. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 21:57, 29 April 2024 (UTC)
===Alternate proposal: Restricted group and abusefilter sysop group===
Rather than the above: Create a <code>abusefilter-restricted</code> group, grantable and removable only by Stewards at their discretion or upon a community partial ban from the abuse filter, with rights related to modification and private filters actively revoked. This would curb abuse (such as of the guidance filter), whilst making allowance for testing. In addition, I will also propose the AbuseFilter sysop group mentioned above in this proposal too, with the modify-restricted right, grantable upon consensus of at least two stewards or of the community. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 21:55, 29 April 2024 (UTC)


:{{ping|X|LisafBia|Dmehus|Codename Noreste|Harvici}} as participants in the RfC above. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 22:05, 29 April 2024 (UTC)
<code>non-steward-suppressor</code>Non-steward suppressor
::I'd support that. [[User:X|'''<span style="background:#3383ff;color:white;padding:5px;box-shadow:0 1px 1px 0 rgba(0,0,0,0.2)">X</span>''']] ([[User talk:X|talk]] + [[Special:Contributions/X|contribs]]) 22:47, 29 April 2024 (UTC)
:::So what will we name this group? [[User:Codename Noreste|<span style="font-family:Verdana;color:#0024FF">'''''Codename Noreste'''''</span>]] 🤔 [[User talk:Codename Noreste|<span style="font-family:Verdana;color:#0A16A5">''La Suma''</span>]] 23:07, 29 April 2024 (UTC)
::::In terms of human readable language, something along the lines of "Users restricted from editing the edit filter" (or a shortened version that conveys the same information) would be the first choice for a name (to me). [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 00:36, 30 April 2024 (UTC)
:::::How about "Users blocked from the abuse filter" for the <code>abusefilter-restricted</code> right, and "Abuse filter administrators" for <code>abusefilter-sysop</code>? The former would be useful for say, Piccadilly if they have one more chance (which I doubt) while they may not edit any filter or view any private filters, including one that restricts their disruptive actions. [[User:Codename Noreste|<span style="font-family:Verdana;color:#0024FF">'''''Codename Noreste'''''</span>]] 🤔 [[User talk:Codename Noreste|<span style="font-family:Verdana;color:#0A16A5">''La Suma''</span>]] 01:20, 30 April 2024 (UTC)
::::::Both of those sound good. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 01:21, 30 April 2024 (UTC)
:::::::Abuse filter administrators have the additional ability to modify filters with blocking abilities in the same fashion as stewards do, while users blocked from the abuse filter may not edit any filter or view private filters; however, they can still see said public filters and the abuse log. I will update my proposed policy on the abuse filter. [[User:Codename Noreste|<span style="font-family:Verdana;color:#0024FF">'''''Codename Noreste'''''</span>]] 🤔 [[User talk:Codename Noreste|<span style="font-family:Verdana;color:#0A16A5">''La Suma''</span>]] 01:24, 30 April 2024 (UTC)
::::::::It is also possible that users blocked from the abuse filter will be able to view private filters to learn from their mistakes/abuse, seeing my discussion with [[User:Dmehus|Doug]] below. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 01:26, 30 April 2024 (UTC)
:::::::::Couldn't we simply revoke the <code>abusefilter-view-private</code> and <code>abusefilter-log-private</code> in the abusefilter-restricted right, and that trusted users experienced with abuse filters should take care not to discuss private filters in public? [[User:Codename Noreste|<span style="font-family:Verdana;color:#0024FF">'''''Codename Noreste'''''</span>]] 🤔 [[User talk:Codename Noreste|<span style="font-family:Verdana;color:#0A16A5">''La Suma''</span>]] 01:29, 30 April 2024 (UTC)
::::::::::That is one of three possibilities. I would be more supportive of a separate group restricting view access or of not doing so and simply restricting edit access, due to the rational possibility of a restricted user looking at a filter to learn from their mistakes. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 01:36, 30 April 2024 (UTC)
::{{support}} [[User:LisafBia|LisafBia]] ([[User talk:LisafBia|talk]]) 08:59, 30 April 2024 (UTC)
:That could be a good way of doing it. So you're proposing to use [[mw:Manual:$wgRevokePermissions|<code>$wgRevokePermissions</code>]] essentially, to revoke all abuse filter permissions normally granted to the <code>sysop</code> group by way of a new user group, though I'd suggest a friendly amendment, if you're amenable to it, of permitting ''view only'' access to the filter (so such partially blocked/banned users could use it to actually ''learn'' from their mistakes)? You would then propose to give access to the restricted abusefilter permissions as part of a new group? If ''so'', I'm in favour of the former, but a little lukewarm on the latter. Not necessarily ''against'' it, but also not entirely sure the ''need'', given the level of active stewards we have now and being concerned with regard to [[w:WP:HATCOLLECT|hat collecting]]. I'd be ''more'' favourable, if we added some removal criteria (i.e., unused completely in the last 30-60 days), by community revocation with a 75% net support ratio, or by consensus of two or more stewards. [[User:Dmehus|Dmehus]] ([[User talk:Dmehus|talk]]) 23:18, 29 April 2024 (UTC)
::I would support the removal criteria for the modify restricted right (or abusefilter sysop). Though I am definitely amenable to view only access for the group restricted from modification, I am also thinking of how that could be abused by a user with a certain level of knowledge. Perhaps that could be left out for now, to avoid creating 2 separate groups? [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 00:30, 30 April 2024 (UTC)
::I propose that we create three seperate rights <code>abusefilter-sysop</code>, <code>abusefliter-restricted</code> ,<code>abusefilter-view-restricted</code> .If the crat [[User:Harvici/Bureaucrat requirements|policy]] passes then we could remove all the abusefilter rights from the sysop and bundle them into <code>abusefilter-sysop</code> which would only be granted if the user is a crat (since to become a crat they have to prove us that they are trustworthy). <code>abusefilter-restricted</code> only let the user only view the abuse filters (steward will only place this right if a user has misused the abusefilter or the user just wants to view and not edit) and <code>abusefilter-view-restricted</code> will not allow the users to even view any abuse filter (this would only be placed if the user has caused serious disruption ) [[User:Harvici|<span style="font-family:Segoe print; color:#CC4E5C ; text-shadow:gray 0.2em 0.2em 0.4em;">Harvici</span>]] ([[User talk:Harvici|<span style="color:#228B22">''talk''</span>]]) 01:50, 30 April 2024 (UTC)
:::Sorry, but I'm gonna have to disagree. I would NOT suggest removing the abuse filter modification rights from the sysop toolset, and if an admin only wants to view abuse filters, including private filters, then they should not edit said filters at all. As for the revocation of viewing abuse filters, I think you meant the revocation of viewing private filters and editing all filters, which should probably be merged to the abusefilter-restricted right. [[User:Codename Noreste|<span style="font-family:Verdana;color:#0024FF">'''''Codename Noreste'''''</span>]] 🤔 [[User talk:Codename Noreste|<span style="font-family:Verdana;color:#0A16A5">''La Suma''</span>]] 02:01, 30 April 2024 (UTC)
::::Well, then we can create one right: <code>abusefilter-sysop</code>.We would remove all the abusefilter filter-related rights (except the ability to view) from sysop toolset.All the users don't have experience with abuse filters (they can also cause disruption even in good faith), and there is no need to give them until they request <code>abusefilter-sysop</code>which would have the ability to edit the filters and it would be granted by stewards [[User:Harvici|<span style="font-family:Segoe print; color:#CC4E5C ; text-shadow:gray 0.2em 0.2em 0.4em;">Harvici</span>]] ([[User talk:Harvici|<span style="color:#228B22">''talk''</span>]]) 13:18, 30 April 2024 (UTC)


==Umm....==
With the following rights:
I have one last account rename request for the stewards: Jody. [[User:Jody|Saint]] ([[User talk: Jody|talk]]) 00:08, 28 April 2024 (UTC)


:{{done}}. Feel free to come back and request another, within reason. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 00:19, 28 April 2024 (UTC)
<code>unblockable</code>


==One more rename request==
Add groups to own account: Suppressor


I actually intended to put Noreste instead of Norte; therefore, I am requesting a rename to '''''Codename Noreste''''' one last time to match Wikimedia and The Test Wiki. Thank you. [[User:Codename Noreste|<span style="font-family:Verdana;color:#0024FF">'''''Codename Norte'''''</span>]] 🤔 [[User talk:Codename Noreste|<span style="color:#0a13ad">talk</span>]] 03:26, 28 April 2024 (UTC)
Remove groups from own account: Suppressor


:{{done}}. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 03:53, 28 April 2024 (UTC)

<code>non-steward-checkuser</code> Non-steward CheckUser

With the following rights:

<code>unblockable</code>

<code>checkuser-log</code>

Add groups to own account: Check user

Remove groups from own account: Check user

Thank you, [[User:Zippybonzo|Zippybonzo]] ([[User talk:Zippybonzo|talk]]) 13:00, 18 July 2023 (UTC)

*{{support}}: This is a reasonable proposal, and allows trusted community members to assist Stewards in maintaining the wiki if they don't want or need the full steward toolset. Although, if someone is trusted enough for either of these, they should have at least part of the privileges of a Steward, such as the ability to [[Test Wiki: Bureaucrats|indefinitely block in difficult cases, being exempt from the recommendations for bureaucrats]]. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 14:52, 28 July 2023 (UTC)
*{{oppose}}: Why do both sets of rights need the <code>unblockable</code> right? [[User:Dusti|Dusti]] ([[User talk:Dusti|talk]]) 14:53, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

==Please remove X'interface admin rights==
<div class="boilerplate metadata discussion-archived" style="background-color: #F2F4FC; margin: 2em 0 0 0; padding: 0 10px 0 10px; border: 1px solid #aaa">
:''The following discussion is closed. <b style="color:red">Please do not modify it</b>. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section.'' {{nd}} - X has become active again, so that is no longer necessary. [[User:Drummingman|Drummingman]] ([[User talk:Drummingman|talk]]) 18:07, 28 July 2023 (UTC)
X writes on his user page, "I don't plan to be active here." Interface admin privileges are very strong and inactive and can be hijacked and should be removed. [[User:Chqaz|Chqaz]] ([[User talk:Chqaz|talk]]) 08:24, 28 July 2023 (UTC)

:I don't think that's necessary [[Special:MobileDiff/29357|anymore]]? [[User:Drummingman|Drummingman]] ([[User talk:Drummingman|talk]]) 13:53, 28 July 2023 (UTC)
:X has told me multiple times they would like to retain their rights. Not necessary... [[User:Zippybonzo|Zippybonzo]] ([[User talk:Zippybonzo|talk]]) 13:56, 28 July 2023 (UTC)
::I for one can vouch that X would prefer to retain their rights as per an email conversation. [[User:Sav|Sav]] • ([[Special:Contribs/Sav|<span style="color:#0080ff"> Edits</span>]] | [[Special:Newsection/User talk:Sav|<span style="color:#0080ff">Talk </span>]]) 15:57, 28 July 2023 (UTC)
{{Discussion bottom}}

==Request for System Administrator: Zippybonzo==
{{Discussion top|{{Not Done}} per block. [[User:MacFan4000|MacFan4000]] <sup>([[User talk:MacFan4000|Talk]] [[Special:Contributions/MacFan4000|Contribs]])</sup> 12:59, 6 August 2023 (UTC)}}
Hello TestWiki.Wiki Community,

I am proposing myself for the system administrator position, to help keep the server running and configured as we would like it, as our current sysadmin isn't as active as they could be, and I think I could help supplement them. My experience consists of having a pretty good understanding of MediaWiki and some PHP, and I am pretty experienced with GitHub and SSH.

Thank you for your consideration, <br><br> [[User:Zippybonzo|Zippybonzo]] ([[User talk:Zippybonzo|talk]]) 19:07, 1 August 2023 (UTC)
===Questions:===
*Im not convinced there’s a huge need for another system administrator. If elected, what would your first action be, to prove there’s a need for an action. [[User:X|X]] ([[User talk:X|talk]]) 19:12, 1 August 2023 (UTC)
::To close my open pull request on GH to add <code>checkuser-log</code> to the steward user group as per an above discussion. [[User:Zippybonzo|Zippybonzo]] ([[User talk:Zippybonzo|talk]]) 19:13, 1 August 2023 (UTC)
===Discussion:===
===Support===
===Oppose===
*{{Oppose}} -- I'm sorry to say it: To my knowledge, Zippybonzo is not (has not been) a steward or system administrator on a Wikimedia, Miraheze or other large wikifarm. On these wikis, you only become one after a thorough review and vote. To me, that is a hard requirement for a system administrator. SA has the unlimited power to shut down an entire wiki (database lock and unlock) block anyone and deny anyone user rights. Therefore, this right can only be granted to highly trusted users. At the moment, I am not convinced that Zippybonzo meets this requirement. Of course, technical competence is also very important. But I think that is secondary to the above requirement. [[User:Drummingman|Drummingman]] ([[User talk:Drummingman|talk]]) 09:59, 5 August 2023 (UTC)
*:Just to be completely clear here, I am one of the most trustable users on this wiki, given my reputation on enwiki. Now whether you don't believe that holding trusted positions on the largest wiki in the world is 'trusted' is a different question, which I will not ask. However your definition of trusted is very specific. Based on how you think technical competence is secondary to trust, I don't believe this vote is taking into perspective both the need of a sysadmin for this wiki, and other factors. [[User:Zippybonzo|Zippybonzo]] ([[User talk:Zippybonzo|talk]]) 11:05, 5 August 2023 (UTC)
**:{{Oppose}} -- I agree with Drummingman's thoughts and opinions. I am also opposing due to Zippybonzo's passive-aggressive response to the opposal by Drummingman. [[User:Sav|Sav]] • ([[Special:Contribs/Sav|<span style="color:#0080ff"> Edits</span>]] | [[Special:Newsection/User talk:Sav|<span style="color:#0080ff">Talk </span>]]) 21:17, 5 August 2023 (UTC)
*'''Strongest oppose''' Per Drummingman and Zippybonzo is blocked for sockpuppetry and abuse on 3 wikis. He has destroyed moviepedia 2 times and he can hack other accounts. [[User:AlPaD|AlPaD]] ([[User talk:AlPaD|talk]]) 11:06, 6 August 2023 (UTC)
*{{oppose}} per Sav. [[User:X|X]] ([[User talk:X|talk]]) 12:02, 6 August 2023 (UTC)

===Neutral===
{{Discussion bottom}}

==Block review of [[User:Zippybonzo|Zippybonzo]]==
{{Discussion top|Although I am involved by participating, consensus is clear here: All arguments in favor of unblocking Zippybonzo, even conditionally, have been refuted, and therefore there is ''consensus against'' unblocking Zippybonzo. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 00:46, 9 August 2023 (UTC)}}
I'm not one to usually interfere with the runnings of other wiki's, however, it's come to my attention that Zippybonzo was blocked here for some schenanigans that went on last week on another wiki. I don't see a policy in place where harmless pranks can result in a block here, and I'd like to call the community's attention to the block and ask that it be lifted.

While it really shouldn't have happened, generally speaking I don't see off wiki conduct (like a prank) needing something as significant as an indefinite block labelled as a Steward action.

The user on the other end of the prank actually threatened Zippybonzo with violence, which resulted in an [https://thetestwiki.com/index.php?title=Special:Log&logid=111 indefinite block] on my TestWiki along with a lock of their global account. That conduct I can certainly see resulting in an indefinite block. [[User:Dusti|Dusti]] ([[User talk:Dusti|talk]]) 14:47, 7 August 2023 (UTC)
:I tend to agree with this assessment. Unless the off-wiki matter involves serious issues such as severe harassment or threats of violence, like noted above, I don't see how people's actions on one wiki should affect their standings on other wikis. [[User:Piccadilly|Piccadilly]] ([[Special:Contribs/Piccadilly|<span style="color:red">My Contribs</span>]] | [[Special:Newsection/User talk:Piccadilly|<span style="color:#0080ff">Talk to me</span>]]) 14:51, 7 August 2023 (UTC)
:I oppose. The reason for said block is clearly stated and so, his block '''should''' remain active. [[User:Sav|Sav]] • ([[Special:Contribs/Sav|<span style="color:#0080ff"> Edits</span>]] | [[Special:Newsection/User talk:Sav|<span style="color:#0080ff">Talk </span>]]) 15:57, 7 August 2023 (UTC)
:A prank requires the other party to laugh. Severely disrupting a wiki and then claiming it was a prank after the owner of said wiki repeatedly attempted to stop said disruption doesn't work. It's like playing a prank on the Wikipedia community as an admin by deleting [[Wikipedia:Barack Obama|an article on a president of the United States]] and then blocking [[Wikipedia:User:Jimbo Wales|Jimbo]]. This was intentionally inflicting emotional harm on (trolling) another member of this wiki, [[User:Cocopuff2018|Cocopuff2018]], and therefore I have no problem with the block. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 16:26, 7 August 2023 (UTC)
:I simply don’t believe my actions on one wiki should be carried over to an entirely unrelated wiki. The actions were unwise, but I did not violate the policies of that wiki. [[User:Zippybonzo|Zippybonzo]] ([[User talk:Zippybonzo|talk]]) 16:57, 7 August 2023 (UTC) <small>copied to the community portal by [[User:X|X]] ([[User talk:X|talk]]). </small>
::This response is.. not good. A wiki or other community does not have to codify: "Disrupting us is prohibited." That is assumed to be the case. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 17:05, 7 August 2023 (UTC)
:::Whilst that is true, there is no reason the block from an entirely unrelated wiki should be carried over to this wiki. [[User:Zippybonzo|Zippybonzo]] ([[User talk:Zippybonzo|talk]]) 17:20, 7 August 2023 (UTC) - moved to the community portal by [[User:X|X]] ([[User talk:X|talk]]).
::::There is a valid reason for extending the block to this Wiki. Even though this is a Test Wiki, we must uphold responsibility and avoid any form of abuse, a concept that seems to have been misunderstood in your case. [[User:Sav|Sav]] • ([[Special:Contribs/Sav|<span style="color:#0080ff"> Edits</span>]] | [[Special:Newsection/User talk:Sav|<span style="color:#0080ff">Talk </span>]]) 17:31, 7 August 2023 (UTC)
::::It's not being carried over. You intentionally inflicted emotional distress upon [[User:Cocopuff2018|a fellow member of this wiki]], which earned you a block on this wiki to prevent further problems and deter your disruptive behavior. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 17:33, 7 August 2023 (UTC) <small>(edit conflict)</small>
:::::I tend to agree with Zippybonzo on this point. I think each wiki should be a "fresh start" so to speak, where as long as a user doesn't cause any serious disruption on this wiki, they shouldn't be blocked based on off-wiki matters. If we're going by the principle that Justarandomamerican suggests, then to be honest I would probably be blocked here as well because of issues from thetestwiki.org and Wikimedia. So why is it that off-wiki matters don't count against me but they do for Zippybonzo? [[User:Piccadilly|Piccadilly]] ([[Special:Contribs/Piccadilly|<span style="color:red">My Contribs</span>]] | [[Special:Newsection/User talk:Piccadilly|<span style="color:#0080ff">Talk to me</span>]]) 17:34, 7 August 2023 (UTC)
::::::No, because your issues do not involve trolling members of this wiki. In this case, it actually affects this wiki due to causing emotional distress to its contributors, and deserves a block. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 17:37, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

===Proposal===
I have an idea regarding this block situation. I understand that some undesireable things have happened between Cocopuff and Zippybonzo, but maybe we can unblock Zippybonzo (with a steward's agreement) on the condition that any undesireable behavior here will result in a reblock? I think that's reasonable. [[User:Piccadilly|Piccadilly]] ([[Special:Contribs/Piccadilly|<span style="color:red">My Contribs</span>]] | [[Special:Newsection/User talk:Piccadilly|<span style="color:#0080ff">Talk to me</span>]]) 21:13, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

:<s>That sounds reasonable, how about we word it like this: "Any behavior that is disruptive to this wiki, in the judgment of a Bureaucrat, shall result in an immediate indefinite <ins>site-wide</ins> reblock, account creation disabled, autoblock enabled, with other settings being at the Bureaucrat's discretion." [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 21:21, 7 August 2023 (UTC)</s>

::Yeah that sounds good to me. [[User:Piccadilly|Piccadilly]] ([[Special:Contribs/Piccadilly|<span style="color:red">My Contribs</span>]] | [[Special:Newsection/User talk:Piccadilly|<span style="color:#0080ff">Talk to me</span>]]) 21:36, 7 August 2023 (UTC)
:::I'd like clarification on what would become of Zippys sysop/IA/crat status, if this proposal was implemented. [[User:X|X]] ([[User talk:X|talk]]) 22:09, 7 August 2023 (UTC)
::::<s>IA is already removed, and should stay as such for the foreseeable future. Crat shouldn't be allowed until a certain period of time has passed, around 6 weeks IMO, but sysop should be regranted. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 22:17, 7 August 2023 (UTC)</s>
:::::I’m going to oppose this alternate proposal due to some discord messages Zippy has left me. You can email/DM me if needed. [[User:X|X]] ([[User talk:X|talk]]) 10:53, 8 August 2023 (UTC)
::::::<s>Please can you provide me evidence of these Discord messages? You have my contact information. [[User:Sav|Sav]] • ([[Special:Contribs/Sav|<span style="color:#0080ff"> Edits</span>]] | [[Special:Newsection/User talk:Sav|<span style="color:#0080ff">Talk </span>]]) 15:11, 8 August 2023 (UTC)</s>


strong oppose, im sorry but i dont trust him at all. and he was just recently block I think it's still too early. [[User:Cocopuff2018|Cocopuff2018]] ([[User talk:Cocopuff2018|talk]]) 14:47, 8 August 2023 (UTC)
*Unfortunately, I must oppose at this point in time, as ZB has said privately he is tempted to abuse this wiki. The block will prevent such a thing from happening. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 16:31, 8 August 2023 (UTC)
*: Echoing the sentiments of @[[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]], I stand unfortunately oppose as well. Having personally encountered the comments posted by ZB, I agree with the concerns raised. [[User:Sav|Sav]] • ([[Special:Contribs/Sav|<span style="color:#0080ff"> Edits</span>]] | [[Special:Newsection/User talk:Sav|<span style="color:#0080ff">Talk </span>]]) 16:38, 8 August 2023 (UTC)
{{Discussion bottom}}
==Request for Stewardship: Justarandomamerican==
I nominate myself for Stewardship due to there only being 1 regularly active Steward, Drummingman. MacFan4000 is semi-active, and Dmehus? He has not been active since the 3rd of July. I've been active here for quite a bit, and it's not really a great idea to have 1 active person taking care of most Steward maintenance tasks, so I volunteer to be the second. Account Security: I have a strong password securing my account and MFA enabled. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 20:26, 18 August 2023 (UTC)

===Questions===

====Self-imposed FAQ====
#When will you use the suppression toolset?
#:I will use it in any of the following scenarios: Personally identifiable information of anyone being shared without their consent, PII of an apparent minor being shared, anything else that the public at large should not be able to view, as sysop rights are easy to obtain, that is the purpose of the wiki, and external links containing one of those three scenarios. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 20:26, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
#When will you use the check user toolset?
#:I will use it only to investigate, respond to, and/or prevent disruption such as sockpuppetry or vandalism, in accordance with the Privacy policy's abuse provision. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 20:26, 18 August 2023 (UTC)

====Other Questions====
#. What is your take on off wiki/off site behavior impacting a user account here? Let's say on another wiki, unrelated to this site. [[User:Dusti|Dusti]] ([[User talk:Dusti|talk]]) 14:11, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
#:I do not feel it warrants a block or other action, unless it materially affects this wiki, such as [[wikipedia:Wikipedia:OWH|off-wiki harassment]] by a contributor to another contributor, or if, in the totality of the circumstances, it could result in disruption here. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 14:36, 19 August 2023 (UTC)


===Support===
#. I'll kick this off with your first support. [[User:Dusti|Dusti]] ([[User talk:Dusti|talk]]) 01:36, 20 August 2023 (UTC)
# Trusted user. [[User:AlPaD|AlPaD]] ([[User talk:AlPaD|talk]]) 07:08, 26 August 2023 (UTC)

===Oppose===

===Neutral/abstain===
#I’m going to be neutral here, and I feel that Justa should withdraw this and wait. A wiki that the candidate and I were stewards on was recently closed because of actions taken by the steward team. I don’t think that starting an RfS on another TestWiki days after another one was closed, partially because of our actions, is a good look or idea. [[User:X|X]] ([[User talk:X|talk]]) 01:57, 20 August 2023 (UTC)
#:This has been discussed at length in private by us two and ZB, a user who is ''de facto'' banned by the community on this wiki (declined block review) due to their actions, and it was decided that the closure was wrong overall. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 02:06, 20 August 2023 (UTC)
:::Yes, but that is our personal opinions, not the opinion of the site creator and operator. In his opinion, we completely ruined the wiki. Which is why the above still, regardless, stands. [[User:X|X]] ([[User talk:X|talk]]) 02:09, 20 August 2023 (UTC)
::::He can operate his site as he wishes, including resetting the wiki even though the community thinks it was wrong, and he could even rule the wiki as an absolute dictator without consequence. There is no rational cause --> effect sequence here: I take action based on off-wiki and on-wiki repeated civility issues, that does not cause the site as a whole to be ruined. I have no other involvement in the points MTzh brought up, I believe, although I do not remember them and they can no longer be accessed. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 02:18, 20 August 2023 (UTC)
:::::My point is that a block you placed that, while I do believe it was correct, partially led to the reset and closure of a wiki. I just think it’s too soon. [[User:X|X]] ([[User talk:X|talk]]) 02:34, 20 August 2023 (UTC)

===Other comments===

Revision as of 13:18, 30 April 2024

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Proposal

Hello, I happy to here to discuss on my new proposal to make a mediawikipage for this this JavaScript that help to easily block and oversight or suppress the revision of block user, spammers. etc, this script is originally based on User:WhitePhosphorus/js/all-in-one.js of metawikimedia, but this script needed to modified them, then it's script ready for use on Tesrwiki.

  • I think User:Aviram7/js/all-in-one.js is move to mediawiki namespace, then add this script in gadget and allow to sysop, crats, stewards for use on you're preferences.

@MacFan4000, Dmehus, Drummingman, and Justarandomamerican: Thanks ~~ αvírαm|(tαlk) 08:36, 9 April 2024 (UTC)Reply

I would be fine with adding this as a gadget, but not on the common.js. X (talk + contribs) 10:10, 9 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
@X: Hello, Well! we have no probelm, If you like more gadgets for use, please see my common. js and this gadget is very helpful, firstly please test this js and then we think what can I do later?.

Thanks ~~ αvírαm|(tαlk) 12:41, 9 April 2024 (UTC)Reply

This gadget would likely need to be restricted to stewards due to just how powerful it is. Being able to revert all of a users edits, delete all the pages they've created, and block them in one click is simply a lot. X (talk + contribs) 18:40, 9 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
X, You're right this js script is very powerful Use of this JavaScript should only be allowed by stewards and not allowed to use by any other privileged persons. ~~ αvírαm|(tαlk) 03:56, 10 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
I've commented it out of your common.js page for the moment, as it could cause some serious mayhem if used improperly. Ask me if you need a test performed. Justarandomamerican (talk) 14:42, 10 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
@Justarandomamerican Hello, Thank you for removing this script from my common. js, I've already performed the after adding this script on my common. js, I think this js script is more useful for the stewards.  Thanks ~~ αvírαm|(tαlk) 15:21, 10 April 2024 (UTC)Reply

Replace text

I've used it a lot in the past, and it saved a lot of time. But as of now, it's restricted to stewards. Why's that? Saint (talk) 04:43, 10 April 2024 (UTC)Reply

It was found that a vandal who gained sysop rights could vandalize the Main Page or similarly important Steward protected pages using ReplaceText. I know it has a lot of utility for you, so feel free to send me a message on my talk page, or Drummingman on his with a request, ensuring that original text, new text, and namespace(s) are provided. Justarandomamerican (talk) 12:53, 10 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
Is it possible to allow interface administrators to use it? X (talk + contribs) 13:16, 10 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
I suggested that to MacFan when I originally opened a security task about the issue. Me personally, I think it would be better to create a separate group that's able to use it, as IA is primarily intended to allow editing of script pages, though I am fine with bundling it in to IA (and Stewards) along with creating a separate group. Justarandomamerican (talk) 13:19, 10 April 2024 (UTC)Reply

'Crat sysop first requirement

@EPIC, X, and DR: as interested persons. Recently, upon DR requesting bureaucrat, they were given it without first being an administrator. EPIC removed the crat right, and X restored it, stating that the requirement was pointless. To prevent a wheel war, I think it's best to set down community consensus on the issue. What do you, the reader, think of the requirement to be a sysop before being a bureaucrat? Justarandomamerican (talk) 03:33, 11 April 2024 (UTC)Reply

@Justarandomamerican: I've support you're thoughts, This is test wiki not Wikipedia, we are here to testing of specific permission, firstly If any new user request for both rights, then firstly grant only sysop permission but not crats, because sysop have more permission on his group, crats is most important permission on the wiki, I don't understand why both user's make editwar in removing or adding crats permission from @DR, who received both permission after reviewing his request by an other crats. ~~ αvírαm|(tαlk) 04:24, 11 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
I personally think that just like on other test wikis, there should some kind of requirement before being able to request crat, either an edit requirement (maybe something like 10 edits before being able to request bureaucrat would be a fair requirement if so?), or a requirement of a specific amount of days of having sysop before requesting crat (a day or two perhaps), or maybe a mix of both of those requirements.
The reason I think so is because unlike on other test wikis, the crat permission is quite powerful and can remove both bureaucrat and sysop rights. If it's given very liberally it can be quite dangerous. Now, I know DR from Wikimedia and they are a trusted user who I certainly don't think would abuse the bureaucrat rights, so I have nothing against them having crat. But, I don't have any intents to wheel war, the permissions have been given back and it can remain so. EPIC (talk) 08:10, 11 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
My intention was also not to wheel war. I know EPIC mentioned some suggestions for "requirements" for the 'crat role. However, as of now, those do not exist, making the rule about being a sysop first pointless. There is some Wikimedia essay about not following the policies if doing so would prevent you from improving the site, but I can't remember what it was titled. X (talk + contribs) 11:51, 11 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
You can remove the bureaucrat right from my account since I won’t be using it. I have MediaWiki installed on my local machine for testing purposes, and I already have all the advanced rights there. Here on this test wiki, my goal is to assist others by deploying some important and useful scripts and translating help pages. Initially, I thought that crats have access to grant the interface admin right, but it appears they do not, so I no longer require this role. Could any Steward please grant the interface admin right to my account? I would like to deploy some useful gadgets. Also, for granting requirements, I believe granting the bureaucrat role should be discretionary. DR (talk) 09:52, 11 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
We should definitely set requirements for gaining crat. It is a powerful position, and any disruptive user can easily misuse it. Since EPIC knew DR , there would not be a problem, but if a random user came and requested sysop and crat, there is a chance of vandalism or disruption. I propose that a user must wait 24 hours and make 10 edits before requesting crat rights Harvici (talk) 06:55, 12 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
It's not a terribly powerful position, since it's mostly a testing right, but that being said, it does require an extra degree of trust as it includes extra permissions like nuke and import, which can cause vandalism that is time consuming to revert if used by unscrupulous actors. Since Justarandomamerican initiated the discussion, I will contribute here and allow Drummingman or MacFan4000 to close. Your suggestion of 10 edits is a good one, but I'd also add a time requirement and would suggest a minimum of a four day wait unless the user previously held user rights here, then the waiting period requirement is waived. We could also add in an alternate pathway to waive the waiting period requirement, such has having a confirmation edit from a mainstream wiki farm (Wikimedia, Fandom, or Miraheze) and being a known user in good standing there. Dmehus (talk) 01:31, 27 April 2024 (UTC)Reply

Permission revocation request

Hello, I am currently suffering from high powerful stress which is impairing my ability to work on test wiki and elsewhere, hence, I request the admins of test wiki to please remove my sysop + crats permission on my account, I will try to come back and edit here. Thanks to all the editors of test wiki for giving me a chance to test the tools of sysop and crats and I hope I have not broken any rules and regulations of test wiki..  Thanks ~~ αvírαm|(tαlk) 04:40, 16 April 2024 (UTC)Reply

 Done — You are free to reapply for user permissions when you return. Drummingman (talk) 08:52, 16 April 2024 (UTC)Reply

Interface Right

Hello everyone, I try to re- modifying Twinkle tool for use, but I don't think Twinkle Tool are working on Test Wiki; If you like I like to fix Twinkle tool for working on Test Wiki, so, I needed, please grant me Interface right for permanently for successfully complete this work. Thanks ~~ αvírαm|(tαlk) 16:46, 18 April 2024 (UTC)Reply

I think that for the moment you can rework this script into personal subpages and we will see later about the rights because other interface admins will be able to add it as a gadget.DodoMan (talk) 16:57, 18 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
@DodoMan: Hello, Do you know Twinkle Tool are not currently available in gadgets section and it's subpages are not currently exist here, We recreating those pages and interface admin right are more help to edit and create js pages on Test Wiki.Cheers!~~ αvírαm|(tαlk) 17:04, 18 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
@Aviram7:Yes I know the tool it’s inavailable but you can rework script on your subpages. At worst, I will create these mediawiki pages and rework them with you. And also you need to request rights to Test Wiki:Request Permissions.DodoMan (talk) 17:17, 18 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
@DodoMan: That's Great! well I going to request for Interface permission on request page and try to creating twinkle subpages on userspace and I beleive our hard struggle will be positive result proved.~~ αvírαm|(tαlk) 17:33, 18 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
I requested for Interface permission on TW:RfP. ~~ αvírαm|(tαlk) 17:40, 18 April 2024 (UTC)Reply

Filter 120

I propose converting it to an abusive username prevention filter. Any objections? Codename Norte 🤔 talk 15:27, 25 April 2024 (UTC)Reply

Nope,is good for me.(oh no is my bot account)BotRafdodo (talk) 16:38, 25 April 2024 (UTC)~Reply
None. Justarandomamerican (talk) 21:46, 25 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
Standby... writing the regex... Codename Norte 🤔 talk 02:16, 26 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
and WHEW!!!  Done. Justarandomamerican, you might want to remove the account creation conditions from filter 92 since I implemented them to filter 120. Codename Norte 🤔 talk 03:31, 26 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
Any objections if I set this to disallow? Codename Norte 🤔 talk 01:47, 27 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
LGTM. I'm not sure the likelihood of LTAs and blocked users trying to use variations of known usernames, but it can't hurt, either. Dmehus (talk) 02:36, 27 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
No, if there's a helpful message. Justarandomamerican (talk) 22:10, 29 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
 Done. Codename Noreste 🤔 La Suma 02:50, 30 April 2024 (UTC)Reply

Crat requirements's policy

As in the above discussion, I have established policy-related criteria for the CRT position, as previously stated by Dmehus, " It's not [...] require an extra degree of trust as it includes extra permissions like nuke and import which can cause vandalism [...]. Harvici (talk) 18:31, 27 April 2024 (UTC)Reply

Adoption Discussion

As a policy, this would practically just codify community norms on how to grant crat rights. I propose (and support) adopting this as policy.

  •  Support Harvici (talk) 18:35, 27 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
  •  Conditional support: I'll support this with the modifications I have made. There should be some level of discretion granted to Stewards, as this is a test wiki, and trusted users should be able to bypass the requirements, along with Stewards being able to requalify a person. Otherwise, I'd say this is a reasonable security requirement. Justarandomamerican (talk) 18:59, 27 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
  •  Conditional support The draft policy isn't exactly as I would've liked, but it's reasonable. Justarandomamerican's reason for additional, common sense exceptions by Stewards is also reasonable, and so I support that. It arguably goes without saying Stewards are able to do this anyway, but I support making this a conditional requirement for my support. Dmehus (talk) 19:12, 27 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
  • What do you guys think about Dmehus suggestion to waive the waiting period requirement, such has having a confirmation edit from a mainstream wiki farm (Wikimedia, Fandom, or Miraheze) and being a known user in good standing there.Should we make a change with respect to this? Harvici (talk) 02:07, 28 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
  •  Comment: Changed the criteria from "must have been a registered user for a minimum of 4 days" to "must have been an administrator for a minimum of 4 days"As any user can ask for crat rights before they even get sysop (the registered criteria is also mentioned on the top) Harvici (talk) 13:11, 29 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
    I'd prefer that, Harvici. I would've preferred your language originally, but wasn't enough to cause me oppose the proposal. Dmehus (talk) 23:22, 29 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
  •  Strong oppose How long has it been since someone has abused their bureaucrat permissions? Months, at least. This simply makes it harder for users to test, and as such, I oppose. X (talk + contribs) 13:27, 29 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
    This isn't about adding revocation criteria, X. As it stands, if you're an existing bureaucrat, you meet the exception criteria to have the bit re-added without the waiting period requirement. I would, however, potentially suggest adding a requirement that the bureaucrat user group is limited to the user's main account only. Justarandomamerican, thoughts? Dmehus (talk) 23:24, 29 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
    I do suppose that could be added, but how would we handle legitimate test (such as testing the bureaucrat right on its own, without sysop) or cratbot accounts? Justarandomamerican (talk) 00:33, 30 April 2024 (UTC)Reply

Omnibus RfC: Unbundling abusefilter permissions from Administrators

I would like to propose all of the following: 1: Unbundle all abusefilter-related (excluding basic rights already included in * or user) from the sysop group. 2. Bundle these rights into the Steward group. 3. Create a new abusefilter-edit group with these rights, and a abusefilter-helper group with view-only access, both grantable by a Steward upon request. Though this would be taking away a permission used by many, the AbuseFilter extension is a very powerful tool: There is the potential for evasion of restrictions imposed on specific users by the ability to view private filters, let alone the fact that a vandal that gets access to it could actually block innocent, or even potentially all edits. If this is implemented, I plan to grant the edit right to those who already work with our edit filters. Justarandomamerican (talk) 21:43, 27 April 2024 (UTC) withdrawn, see my comment below Justarandomamerican (talk) 22:00, 29 April 2024 (UTC)Reply

This sounds good to me. Thanks for starting the RfC. I'd only suggest a small change, by allowing any sysop to view the abuse filters; they just wouldn't be able to edit them unless they have the abusefilter-helper group. I'd also suggest adding both a time-based inactivity requirement (something like 30-90 days) whereby someone not having used the permission in the given time period can lose the permission and also broad Steward discretion to remove the permission where it's either misused or no longer used recently. Dmehus (talk) 00:06, 28 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
That sounds good to me. I only added the "view private filters" unbundle because with a bit of knowledge of the language of abuse filters, you could probably bypass a filter restricting you, but I suppose there isn't a problem with that yet. Justarandomamerican (talk) 00:22, 28 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
 Comment: I am not a sockpuppeteer or something, and I assist with abuse filters almost all the time, but is the abusefilter-edit group not allowed to have the abusefilter-modify-restricted because of the potential of actions that can impact actual users? Codename Norte 🤔 talk 03:20, 28 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
I don't have strong feelings about that. Justarandomamerican (talk) 03:55, 28 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
Should the abusefilter-edit group have the restricted action modifcation right, community consensus or similar is mandatory. Codename Noreste (talk) 03:59, 28 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
The abusefilter-modify-restricted user right is currently restricted to Stewards for mainly security and abuse reasons. I suppose we could sub-delegate this user right, but I'd rather see it be a separate user group, like abusefilter-sysop or something, that would also require a community vote (like non-Steward suppressors) (since it requires an extra degree of trust and also has some real, non-test administrator responsibilities). Dmehus (talk) 16:24, 28 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
I would propose all of the following in addition:
  • All admins should keep the abusefilter-log-detail right.
  • The abusefilter-helper group should only have the abusefilter-view-private and abusefilter-log-private permissions.
  • The abusefilter-edit group should just simply have the name abusefilter, and have the following rights (in addition to having a community vote requirement):
1) Create or modify abuse filters (abusefilter-modify) [this may or may not need the two rights listed on the abusefilter-helper permission since this permission allows you to view the filters and their logs, whether public or private]
2) Create or modify what external domains are blocked from being linked (abusefilter-modify-blocked-external-domains)
3) Modify abuse filters with restricted actions (abusefilter-modify-restricted)
4) Revert all changes by a given abuse filter (abusefilter-revert)
  • Stewards do not need to assign the abusefilter or abusefilter-helper permission to themselves, but they can assign and remove either of the two to trusted users following a community vote.
Codename Noreste 🤔 La Suma 17:27, 28 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
A community vote and/or Steward discretion (for helper, or granting edit to those who have worked on abuse filters before) or consensus (for neither of those cases), I presume? Appointment by community vote only would be a higher bar than we set for our non-steward suppressors. Justarandomamerican (talk) 18:24, 28 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
 Conditional support per my comment above. Justarandomamerican (talk) 18:25, 28 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
I am writing a proposed policy about the abuse filter and their proposed user rights; anyone can help. Codename Noreste 🤔 La Suma 01:20, 29 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
 Strong Support I support this proposal. ~~ αvírαm|(tαlk) 09:28, 29 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
How long has it been since someone has abused abuse filter access? Months, years? I don't ever recall this being an issue. Like the above proposal, this simply makes it harder for users to test and I will always  Strongly oppose that. X (talk + contribs) 13:29, 29 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
This also makes it extremely difficult to make small changes to abusefilters, or fix bugs. This is a solution looking for a problem, in addition to being extremely bureaucratic. Must I remind everyone that this is a testwiki, where people test tools like abusefilter? X (talk + contribs) 17:09, 29 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
 Strong Support I added a lot of content to the policy; feel free to add your own suggestion :) Harvici (talk) 14:49, 29 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
 Oppose I haven't found any vandalism in the abuse filters so far. It seems unnecessary to make such a change when there is no vandalism. Therefore, I am opposing this proposal. LisafBia (talk) 17:16, 29 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
I now  withdraw my proposal and oppose the policy proposal upon reading the two rational oppose comments. Justarandomamerican (talk) 21:57, 29 April 2024 (UTC)Reply

Alternate proposal: Restricted group and abusefilter sysop group

Rather than the above: Create a abusefilter-restricted group, grantable and removable only by Stewards at their discretion or upon a community partial ban from the abuse filter, with rights related to modification and private filters actively revoked. This would curb abuse (such as of the guidance filter), whilst making allowance for testing. In addition, I will also propose the AbuseFilter sysop group mentioned above in this proposal too, with the modify-restricted right, grantable upon consensus of at least two stewards or of the community. Justarandomamerican (talk) 21:55, 29 April 2024 (UTC)Reply

@X, LisafBia, Dmehus, Codename Noreste, and Harvici: as participants in the RfC above. Justarandomamerican (talk) 22:05, 29 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
I'd support that. X (talk + contribs) 22:47, 29 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
So what will we name this group? Codename Noreste 🤔 La Suma 23:07, 29 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
In terms of human readable language, something along the lines of "Users restricted from editing the edit filter" (or a shortened version that conveys the same information) would be the first choice for a name (to me). Justarandomamerican (talk) 00:36, 30 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
How about "Users blocked from the abuse filter" for the abusefilter-restricted right, and "Abuse filter administrators" for abusefilter-sysop? The former would be useful for say, Piccadilly if they have one more chance (which I doubt) while they may not edit any filter or view any private filters, including one that restricts their disruptive actions. Codename Noreste 🤔 La Suma 01:20, 30 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
Both of those sound good. Justarandomamerican (talk) 01:21, 30 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
Abuse filter administrators have the additional ability to modify filters with blocking abilities in the same fashion as stewards do, while users blocked from the abuse filter may not edit any filter or view private filters; however, they can still see said public filters and the abuse log. I will update my proposed policy on the abuse filter. Codename Noreste 🤔 La Suma 01:24, 30 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
It is also possible that users blocked from the abuse filter will be able to view private filters to learn from their mistakes/abuse, seeing my discussion with Doug below. Justarandomamerican (talk) 01:26, 30 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
Couldn't we simply revoke the abusefilter-view-private and abusefilter-log-private in the abusefilter-restricted right, and that trusted users experienced with abuse filters should take care not to discuss private filters in public? Codename Noreste 🤔 La Suma 01:29, 30 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
That is one of three possibilities. I would be more supportive of a separate group restricting view access or of not doing so and simply restricting edit access, due to the rational possibility of a restricted user looking at a filter to learn from their mistakes. Justarandomamerican (talk) 01:36, 30 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
 Support LisafBia (talk) 08:59, 30 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
That could be a good way of doing it. So you're proposing to use $wgRevokePermissions essentially, to revoke all abuse filter permissions normally granted to the sysop group by way of a new user group, though I'd suggest a friendly amendment, if you're amenable to it, of permitting view only access to the filter (so such partially blocked/banned users could use it to actually learn from their mistakes)? You would then propose to give access to the restricted abusefilter permissions as part of a new group? If so, I'm in favour of the former, but a little lukewarm on the latter. Not necessarily against it, but also not entirely sure the need, given the level of active stewards we have now and being concerned with regard to hat collecting. I'd be more favourable, if we added some removal criteria (i.e., unused completely in the last 30-60 days), by community revocation with a 75% net support ratio, or by consensus of two or more stewards. Dmehus (talk) 23:18, 29 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
I would support the removal criteria for the modify restricted right (or abusefilter sysop). Though I am definitely amenable to view only access for the group restricted from modification, I am also thinking of how that could be abused by a user with a certain level of knowledge. Perhaps that could be left out for now, to avoid creating 2 separate groups? Justarandomamerican (talk) 00:30, 30 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
I propose that we create three seperate rights abusefilter-sysop, abusefliter-restricted ,abusefilter-view-restricted .If the crat policy passes then we could remove all the abusefilter rights from the sysop and bundle them into abusefilter-sysop which would only be granted if the user is a crat (since to become a crat they have to prove us that they are trustworthy). abusefilter-restricted only let the user only view the abuse filters (steward will only place this right if a user has misused the abusefilter or the user just wants to view and not edit) and abusefilter-view-restricted will not allow the users to even view any abuse filter (this would only be placed if the user has caused serious disruption ) Harvici (talk) 01:50, 30 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
Sorry, but I'm gonna have to disagree. I would NOT suggest removing the abuse filter modification rights from the sysop toolset, and if an admin only wants to view abuse filters, including private filters, then they should not edit said filters at all. As for the revocation of viewing abuse filters, I think you meant the revocation of viewing private filters and editing all filters, which should probably be merged to the abusefilter-restricted right. Codename Noreste 🤔 La Suma 02:01, 30 April 2024 (UTC)Reply
Well, then we can create one right: abusefilter-sysop.We would remove all the abusefilter filter-related rights (except the ability to view) from sysop toolset.All the users don't have experience with abuse filters (they can also cause disruption even in good faith), and there is no need to give them until they request abusefilter-sysopwhich would have the ability to edit the filters and it would be granted by stewards Harvici (talk) 13:18, 30 April 2024 (UTC)Reply

Umm....

I have one last account rename request for the stewards: Jody. Saint (talk) 00:08, 28 April 2024 (UTC)Reply

 Done. Feel free to come back and request another, within reason. Justarandomamerican (talk) 00:19, 28 April 2024 (UTC)Reply

One more rename request

I actually intended to put Noreste instead of Norte; therefore, I am requesting a rename to Codename Noreste one last time to match Wikimedia and The Test Wiki. Thank you. Codename Norte 🤔 talk 03:26, 28 April 2024 (UTC)Reply

 Done. Justarandomamerican (talk) 03:53, 28 April 2024 (UTC)Reply