Test Wiki:Community portal: Difference between revisions

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Latest comment: 06:31 by TheAstorPastor in topic Systemadministrator
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==UserRightsManager==
The name of the userRightsManager gadget has changed, so some users may have the tick turned off. It may be necessary to re-enable it in [[Special:Preferences#mw-prefsection-gadgets|the preferences]]. [[User:LisafBia|LisafBia]] ([[User talk:LisafBia|talk]]) 13:01, 1 June 2024 (UTC)


== Mind if I suggest something? ==
==Systemadministrator==
<div class="boilerplate metadata discussion-archived" style="background-color: #F2F4FC; margin: 2em 0 0 0; padding: 0 10px 0 10px; border: 1px solid #aaa">
:''The following discussion is closed. <b style="color:red">Please do not modify it</b>. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section.''
::Consensus in favor of extending the (non-steward/sysadmin) inactivity period to 3 months. —&nbsp;<span style="font-variant: small-caps">[[User:Arcversin|Arcversin]] ([[User talk:Arcversin|talk]])</span> 22:58, 6 May 2022 (UTC)
----
Instead of having your access to the admin tools after 1 month goes by without activity, why not just have it be 3 months instead? I'd say that 1 month is a bit too short, and I'm not sure how one month would be enough of a reason. --[[User:DarkMatterMan4500|DarkMatterMan4500]] ([[User talk:DarkMatterMan4500|talk]]) ([[Special:Contributions/DarkMatterMan4500|contribs]]) 13:51, 17 April 2022 (UTC)
:{{Ping|MacFan4000}} {{Ping|Dmehus}} Hello! How long will the proposal close? [[User:AlPaD|AlPaD]] ([[User talk:AlPaD|talk]]) 12:13, 3 May 2022 (UTC)
==== Supports ====
: {{Support}} I like this idea, and can't see any drawbacks to it. [[User:Seiyena|Sei]] ([[Special:Contribs/Seiyena|<span style="color:red">My changes here</span>]] | [[Special:Newsection/User talk:Seiyena|<span style="color:#0080ff">Drop me a line</span>]]) 16:27, 17 April 2022 (UTC)
: {{Support}} I think it should be extended. [[User:LisafBia|LisafBia]] ([[User talk:LisafBia|talk]]) 16:36, 17 April 2022 (UTC)
: {{Support}} Per nom. [[User:I_am_One|I am one]] ([[User_talk:I_am_One|as you are three]]) 23:13, 17 April 2022 (UTC)
: {{Support}} I absolutely agree with that! [[User:AlPaD|AlPaD]] ([[User talk:AlPaD|talk]]) 14:19, 18 April 2022 (UTC)


=== Oppose ===
{{Ping|MacFan4000}} I would want to say that LisafBia, the two stewards (Drummingman and Justarandomamerican), and I, indicate that I voted, and all votes are oppose (formerly my vote was a neutral, but changed to oppose regarding most people's concerns). MacFan4000, you may have to close as unsuccessful. {{Ping|Justman10000}} If you have any further questions regarding this or want to vote on yourself, please state your questions below the votes in the "Questions by the candidate" section or take place of your vote here before MacFan4000 is closing it. [[User:Tailsultimatefan3891|Tailsultimatefan3891]] ([[User talk:Tailsultimatefan3891|talk]]) 20:26, 2 June 2024 (UTC)
:{{oppose}} We're giving out adminship and 'cratship as if they were candies. Isn't that good enough? [[User:NguoiDungKhongDinhDanh|NguoiDungKhongDinhDanh]] ([[User talk:NguoiDungKhongDinhDanh|talk]]) 10:47, 18 April 2022 (UTC)
::It's definitely good but it would save bureaucrats some work by not having to re-add user rights so often and also save everyone else the hassle of having to ask for the rights again after just a short one-month hiatus. [[User:Seiyena|Sei]] ([[Special:Contribs/Seiyena|<span style="color:red">My changes here</span>]] | [[Special:Newsection/User talk:Seiyena|<span style="color:#0080ff">Drop me a line</span>]]) 12:32, 18 April 2022 (UTC)
:::{{u|NguoiDungKhongDinhDanh}} Being honest, revocation of an advanced permission after 1 month just seems too short, and I'd recommend at least 3 months, as it's usually fair, in terms of how we all operate on the Public Test Wiki on Miraheze. --[[User:DarkMatterMan4500|DarkMatterMan4500]] ([[User talk:DarkMatterMan4500|talk]]) ([[Special:Contributions/DarkMatterMan4500|contribs]]) 13:57, 19 April 2022 (UTC)


=== Neutral ===
<hr>
:{{neutral}}--[[User:S871|S871]] ([[User talk:S871|talk]]) 00:09, 1 May 2022 (UTC)


=== Other Comments ===
I would like to be a system administrator so that I can also support at system configuration level... In addition to managing permissions, I would also keep the software, extensions and skins up to date and optimise the configurations!
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<br>
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive. <b style="color:red">Please do not modify it</b>. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section.'' </div>
<br>
It would be really nice to get a chance 🙂 [[User:Justman10000|Justman10000]] ([[User talk:Justman10000|talk]]) 16:28, 2 June 2024 (UTC)


== Should the policy be updated now? ==
:Did you know how to use Git, PHP, and SSH, and you are active on this wiki? Please see [[Project:System administrators]]. Also, it would be really nice for you to be a system administrator if you know understanding of Apache and a server (MariaDB/MySQL/PostgreSQL/SQLite). [[User:Tailsultimatefan3891|Tailsultimatefan3891]] ([[User talk:Tailsultimatefan3891|talk]]) 17:00, 2 June 2024 (UTC)
Seeing as this has majority support, should one of the bureaucrats update the policy to reflect the new time? Or do we have to get a Steward's approval for policy changes? [[User:Seiyena|Sei]] ([[Special:Contribs/Seiyena|<span style="color:red">My changes here</span>]] | [[Special:Newsection/User talk:Seiyena|<span style="color:#0080ff">Drop me a line</span>]]) 14:11, 19 April 2022 (UTC)
::I already work with Linux Debian since 4 years! So yes 🙂 [[User:Justman10000|Justman10000]] ([[User talk:Justman10000|talk]]) 17:03, 2 June 2024 (UTC)
:::Are you aware that this very high trust permission can cause great damage if it's improperly used? [[User:Codename Noreste|<span style="font-family:Verdana;color:#0024FF">'''''Codename Noreste'''''</span>]] 🤔 [[User talk:Codename Noreste|<span style="font-family:Verdana;color:#0A16A5">''La Suma''</span>]] 17:05, 2 June 2024 (UTC)
::::I am aware of this! Yes [[User:Justman10000|Justman10000]] ([[User talk:Justman10000|talk]]) 17:16, 2 June 2024 (UTC)
:::::So, voting by the two stewards and by some users is required. If the votes are successful, then it goes to the system administrator to grant the permission or not. [[User:Tailsultimatefan3891|Tailsultimatefan3891]] ([[User talk:Tailsultimatefan3891|talk]]) 17:20, 2 June 2024 (UTC)
::::::The votes are all oppose that it is likely to be unsuccessful. [[User:Tailsultimatefan3891|Tailsultimatefan3891]] ([[User talk:Tailsultimatefan3891|talk]]) 20:41, 2 June 2024 (UTC) (sorry for the late signing)


== CheckUser request ==
===Voting===
* [[User:七海娜娜米2b]]
* [[User:七海娜娜米3b]]
* [[User:想舞花]]
These 2 users are blocked intefinite on Chinese Wikipedia and locked on Wikimedia foundation and [https://testwiki.wiki/index.php?title=Special:Log&logid=30118 this action] is suspected. Thanks! [[User:AlPaD|AlPaD]] ([[User talk:AlPaD|talk]]) 16:37, 17 April 2022 (UTC)
:{{Ping|想舞花}} Could you explain the reason for [https://testwiki.wiki/index.php?title=Special:Log&logid=30118 this action] please? [[User:AlPaD|AlPaD]] ([[User talk:AlPaD|talk]]) 20:12, 22 April 2022 (UTC)
::{{ping|AlPaD}} I mean: give him permissions other than admin.--[[User:想舞花|想舞花]] ([[User talk:想舞花|talk]]) 23:19, 22 April 2022 (UTC)
:::{{Ping|想舞花}} Thanks for reply! [[User:AlPaD|AlPaD]] ([[User talk:AlPaD|talk]]) 07:41, 23 April 2022 (UTC)
:Maybe it's their test account. Also, I don't know why being indefinitely blocked on Wikipedia or globally locked on Wikimedia matters here. My Wikimedia account is globally locked and blocked indefinitely on English Wikipedia, but as long as people behave here, I think they should be welcome here. [[User:Seiyena|Sei]] ([[Special:Contribs/Seiyena|<span style="color:red">My changes here</span>]] | [[Special:Newsection/User talk:Seiyena|<span style="color:#0080ff">Drop me a line</span>]]) 20:16, 22 April 2022 (UTC)
::{{Ping|Seiyena}} I don't think is a test account because he had requested administrator rights, while the test accounts don't need to be requested. I just wanted to make sure it wasn't a sockpuppet issue. It's better steward see the issue and let our know if he needs CheckUser. [[User:AlPaD|AlPaD]] ([[User talk:AlPaD|talk]]) 07:41, 23 April 2022 (UTC)
:::I saw it again and maybe I was wrong. In the Chinese Wikipedia there are daily blocked for sockpuppetry and 想舞花 was banned from the Wikimedia foundation while 七海娜娜米 wasn't. I know that even if someone is blocked on Wikimedia they can contribute here and sorry if I was wrong. [[User:AlPaD|AlPaD]] ([[User talk:AlPaD|talk]]) 20:04, 3 May 2022 (UTC)
:七海娜娜米2b and 七海娜娜米3b, are technically identical, 想舞花 is not connected to the other two, but the CU results were interesting. [[User:MacFan4000|MacFan4000]] <sup>([[User talk:MacFan4000|Talk]] [[Special:Contributions/MacFan4000|Contribs]])</sup> 14:47, 4 May 2022 (UTC)
::{{Ping|MacFan4000}} Thank you! [[User:AlPaD|AlPaD]] ([[User talk:AlPaD|talk]]) 17:04, 4 May 2022 (UTC)
:::I'm block they account.--[[User:想舞花|想舞花]] ([[User talk:想舞花|talk]]) 05:56, 6 May 2022 (UTC)
::::They had been blocked with autoblock disabled. I've modified block setting and enabled autoblock.--[[User:Q8j|Q8j]] ([[User talk:Q8j|talk]]) 07:32, 6 May 2022 (UTC)


== [[Special:AbuseFilter/52]] ==
====Support====


The third line should have been <code>& !page_id == 702</code>. Currently it's checking for spam edits on [[TW:RFP]]... [[User:NguoiDungKhongDinhDanh|NguoiDungKhongDinhDanh]] ([[User talk:NguoiDungKhongDinhDanh|talk]]) 10:48, 18 April 2022 (UTC)
====Oppose====
:Pinging {{ping|Dmehus|p=}}. [[User:NguoiDungKhongDinhDanh|NguoiDungKhongDinhDanh]] ([[User talk:NguoiDungKhongDinhDanh|talk]]) 10:49, 18 April 2022 (UTC)
*{{Oppose|Weak Oppose}} Hi, thanks for volunteering. Unfortunately, I must weakly oppose your request at this time due to lack of necessary trust or track record. I do not think you would take the site down, abuse your power in some other way, or go inactive suddenly, but you do not hold Stewardship here or administratorship elsewhere, and you don't have that long of a track record, so I cannot be sure. Consider this a moral support of sorts; I have no objection to another run in the medium-term future. [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 17:32, 2 June 2024 (UTC)
::Can't admins edit the filters themselves? I know that on another wiki that was possible. Just saying. [[User:Seiyena|Sei]] ([[Special:Contribs/Seiyena|<span style="color:red">My changes here</span>]] | [[Special:Newsection/User talk:Seiyena|<span style="color:#0080ff">Drop me a line</span>]]) 19:25, 18 April 2022 (UTC)
*:Like I said, I'd be happy to get a chance, and if you don't think I would abuse my power (which I wouldn't too), then what's the problem? [[User:Justman10000|Justman10000]] ([[User talk:Justman10000|talk]]) 17:44, 2 June 2024 (UTC)
:::Filters with restricted actions (namely, blocking) can only be edited by Stewards. —&nbsp;<span style="font-variant: small-caps">[[User:Arcversin|Arcversin]] ([[User talk:Arcversin|talk]])</span> 01:05, 19 April 2022 (UTC)
*::This permission is very powerful, can lock the database and have access to PHP, SSH, Git, and Github and even Apache and the server (MariaDB/MySQL/PostgreSQL/SQLite). [[User:Tailsultimatefan3891|Tailsultimatefan3891]] ([[User talk:Tailsultimatefan3891|talk]]) 17:47, 2 June 2024 (UTC)
:It would actually be <code>page_id != 702</code>, since this is an equality check. Also, it's generally good practice to surround any negation that isn't a single function with parentheses, like so: <code>!('x' in y)</code> —&nbsp;<span style="font-variant: small-caps">[[User:Arcversin|Arcversin]] ([[User talk:Arcversin|talk]])</span> 01:05, 19 April 2022 (UTC)
*::System administratorship is a very powerful position. I prefer to err on the side of caution. Can you describe your previous experience with FiveM and Minecraft servers? Do you have PHP experience? [[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] ([[User talk:Justarandomamerican|talk]]) 17:48, 2 June 2024 (UTC)
*:::For the networks, I installed and configured web applications and Minecraft plugins [[User:Justman10000|Justman10000]] ([[User talk:Justman10000|talk]]) 17:52, 2 June 2024 (UTC)
*::::Please refer to the following questions:
*::::*Do you have PHP experience?
*::::*Do you have SSH experience?
*::::*Do you have Git/Github experience?
*::::*To make it easier, it is recommended to use MariaDB, MySQL, SQLite, or PostgreSQL server and use Apache. Do you have experience and understanding of that?
*::::[[User:Tailsultimatefan3891|Tailsultimatefan3891]] ([[User talk:Tailsultimatefan3891|talk]]) 01:06, 3 June 2024 (UTC)
*:::::*Yes
*:::::*Yes
*:::::*Yes
*:::::*I have already used all of the mentioned database systems early, so... yes
*:::::[[User:Justman10000|Justman10000]] ([[User talk:Justman10000|talk]]) 05:08, 3 June 2024 (UTC)
*{{oppose}} Hi, nice that you signed up and want to get more involved, I can only appreciate that. But unfortunately, here and for this reason, I want to cast my dissenting vote. I am very reluctant to assign this role to someone I don't know well. Anyway, are you already a system administrator, steward or admin on a major wiki project somewhere? On a Wikimedia, Miraheze or other large wikifarm. On these wikis, you become one only after a thorough review and vote. To me, that is a hard requirement for a system administrator. SA has the unlimited power to shut down an entire wiki (database lock and unlock) block anyone and deny  or grant anyone user rights. Therefore, this right can only be granted to highly trusted users. Of course, this is separate from the technical side, which is also important.  [[User:Drummingman|Drummingman]] ([[User talk:Drummingman|talk]]) 17:48, 2 June 2024 (UTC)
*:Of course, yes, I agree. I absolutely vote and agree on {{Oppose}} but I gave the very strong oppose, biggest, strongest, ever. [[User:Tailsultimatefan3891|Tailsultimatefan3891]] ([[User talk:Tailsultimatefan3891|talk]]) 01:13, 3 June 2024 (UTC)
*{{oppose|Strongly oppose}} It doesn't make much sense to give a user who has been a member for less than 1 month a higher level of authority than even the stewards such as the system administrator. You need to have 3 or more months of activity history. [[User:LisafBia|LisafBia]] ([[User talk:LisafBia|talk]]) 18:14, 2 June 2024 (UTC)
*:Nowhere does it say anything about that... So... And is it so difficult to give someone a chance? It's not really motivating [[User:Justman10000|Justman10000]] ([[User talk:Justman10000|talk]]) 18:25, 2 June 2024 (UTC)
*::See what the text LisafBia and the 2 stewards said, plus the vote from me right below. Not satisfying and broken trust. [[User:Tailsultimatefan3891|Tailsultimatefan3891]] ([[User talk:Tailsultimatefan3891|talk]]) 20:31, 2 June 2024 (UTC)
*{{oppose|Strongly, very strong, extreme, intense, super, mega, kilo, peta, peta, tera, tera, mega, mega, very strong, strongly, bigger, longer, and absolute oppose that is the biggest, longest, and strongest oppose that I will ever give}} Seriously?!? This user has no long history, new to this wiki, despite knowing PHP, SSH, and Git and needs more experience with Apache and a server (PostgreSQL, MariaDB, MySQL, SQLite). System administrator is a very powerful right, even more than interface administrator and especially intended to be more powerful than regular stewards, including grant or revocate anyone user rights, disable OAuth for a user, locking the database and have access to PHP, site-sensitive files, SSH, and Git as well as the server such as MySQL, MariaDB, PostgreSQL, and SQLite and Apache. They'll have access to DefaultSettings.php, LocalSettings.php, and NoLocalSettings.php. This right is extremely powerful. I hope this will be absolutely rejected. You'll hear no complaints from me. [[User:Tailsultimatefan3891|Tailsultimatefan3891]] ([[User talk:Tailsultimatefan3891|talk]]) 20:21, 2 June 2024 (UTC)
*{{oppose|Strong oppose}} per {{tq|Drummingman and Justarandomamerican}}; Justaman10000 joined on test wiki sice 28 May 2024 (7 days) and I don't think they are really eligible for system administrator privileges for at this time and I don't think they are currently fulfill system admin's requirements. Happy testing ~~''<span style="background:#800080;border:1px solid #F62817;border-radius:18px;padding:4px">[[User:Infinity|<span style="color:#00FF00">ínfínítу</span>]] • [[User talk:Infinity|<span style="color:#FF0000">[@píng mє]</span>]]</span>'' 03:38, 3 June 2024 (UTC)


== In regards to [[User:Seiyena]]. ==
====Neutral====
*<s>{{Neutral}} Used Linux Debian and may be trusted, but I don't know if completely trusted.[[User:Tailsultimatefan3891|Tailsultimatefan3891]] ([[User talk:Tailsultimatefan3891|talk]]) 17:21, 2 June 2024 (UTC)</s>
*:I would be! I have already system-administered around 20 Minecraft and FiveM networks! Sure, this has nothing to do with MediaWiki itself, but it's about the principle! As I said, I would be happy to get a chance [[User:Justman10000|Justman10000]] ([[User talk:Justman10000|talk]]) 17:45, 2 June 2024 (UTC)
*::Possibly some enhanced trust would be needed. Try to think when you become a system administrator. [[User:Tailsultimatefan3891|Tailsultimatefan3891]] ([[User talk:Tailsultimatefan3891|talk]]) 17:47, 2 June 2024 (UTC)
*:::Vote since changed. [[User:Tailsultimatefan3891|Tailsultimatefan3891]] ([[User talk:Tailsultimatefan3891|talk]]) 20:20, 2 June 2024 (UTC)


<div class="boilerplate metadata discussion-archived" style="background-color: #F2F4FC; margin: 2em 0 0 0; padding: 0 10px 0 10px; border: 1px solid #aaa">
====Comments====
:''The following discussion is closed. <b style="color:red">Please do not modify it</b>. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section.''
::This has already been addressed, by another user. I strongly loathe any sort of 'community block' for [[w:WP:AGF|good-faith]], even marginally good-faith users. Block, CheckUser, rinse, and repeat has been tried, and I'm not keen to go back there, at least not ''yet''. This is a [[Test Wiki:Stewards|Steward]]-managed affair, and I did suggest it might've been ''too soon'' to grant bureaucrat. In any case, I'm going to work on having [[User:Arcversin|Arcversin]] deploy the Miraheze global abuse filter to mitigate this. I don't believe an indefinite suspension of bureaucrat; I would rather manage this a month at a time. If bureaucrat revocation is required, I'll do that. [[User:Dmehus|Dmehus]] ([[User talk:Dmehus|talk]]) 23:21, 18 April 2022 (UTC)
----


Hi all, I hope this message finds you well.
===Questions by the candidate===
After [[Special:Diff/21471|noticing]] more and more reports regarding Seiyena, I have come to the decision to cast a vote regarding this user.


This user has made '''several''' racist, homophobic and frankly, disgusting comments on this Wiki. They have had chance after chance to stop this behavior and have even been given Administrator permissions after every "apology".
What is actually so damn hard to understand about the sentence, ''It would be really nice to get a chance''? If you're only ever rejected, there comes a day when you don't want to do anything anywhere! Just give it a damn chance and let someone prove themselves... Is that so hard?
Frankly, I think they are unfit to be a sysop on this Wiki and I am here to ask for the community's opinion on a blacklist for requesting permissions.
Pinging {{Ping|Dmehus}} & {{Ping|MacFan4000}} for their opinion. [[User:Trayfel|Trayfel]] • ([[Special:Contribs/Trayfel|<span style="color:#0080ff"> Edits</span>]] | [[Special:Newsection/User talk:Trayfel|<span style="color:#0080ff">Talk </span>]]) 19:21, 18 April 2022 (UTC)


:Question: Is this blacklist intended to be temporary or indefinite? [[User:Seiyena|Sei]] ([[Special:Contribs/Seiyena|<span style="color:red">My changes here</span>]] | [[Special:Newsection/User talk:Seiyena|<span style="color:#0080ff">Drop me a line</span>]]) 19:27, 18 April 2022 (UTC)
It is the unlimited power, yes! But that way I could have proved myself directly! It's extremely unmotivating to first have to do what I know how many weeks or even months of preparatory work, only to probably be rejected again! --[[User:Justman10000|Justman10000]] ([[User talk:Justman10000|talk]]) 05:06, 3 June 2024 (UTC)
::Considering the amount of abuse you have contributed towards this Wiki, I would say if granted, the RFP blacklist would be indefinite. [[User:Trayfel|Trayfel]] • ([[Special:Contribs/Trayfel|<span style="color:#0080ff"> Edits</span>]] | [[Special:Newsection/User talk:Trayfel|<span style="color:#0080ff">Talk </span>]]) 19:30, 18 April 2022 (UTC)
:::{{Ping|Trayfel}} Hello! Maybe for a while she should be blocked from some namespaces and have lower rights (autopatrol, researcher etc). [[User:AlPaD|AlPaD]] ([[User talk:AlPaD|talk]]) 19:33, 18 April 2022 (UTC)
::::I like AlPad's idea, and wouldn't be against a temporary blacklist, to be honest. I don't like the indefinite idea, but do feel that maybe temporary is warranted. [[User:Seiyena|Sei]] ([[Special:Contribs/Seiyena|<span style="color:red">My changes here</span>]] | [[Special:Newsection/User talk:Seiyena|<span style="color:#0080ff">Drop me a line</span>]]) 19:37, 18 April 2022 (UTC)
:::::With all due regards Sieyena, this isn't down to you. {{Ping|AlPaD}} I agree, I think an indefinite blacklist from sysop permissions with the exception of Seiyena being allowed Autopatrol and researcher. Thoughts? [[User:Trayfel|Trayfel]] • ([[Special:Contribs/Trayfel|<span style="color:#0080ff"> Edits</span>]] | [[Special:Newsection/User talk:Trayfel|<span style="color:#0080ff">Talk </span>]]) 19:59, 18 April 2022 (UTC)
I know that I can't make this decision by myself, but I do think I should at least be able to offer my views on this matter. My proposal is a temporary blacklist from requesting permissions together with a partial block from the Talk namespace and maybe the Request Permissions page. [[User:Seiyena|Sei]] ([[Special:Contribs/Seiyena|<span style="color:red">My changes here</span>]] | [[Special:Newsection/User talk:Seiyena|<span style="color:#0080ff">Drop me a line</span>]]) 21:18, 18 April 2022 (UTC)
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:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive. <b style="color:red">Please do not modify it</b>. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section.'' </div>


:Noting that the aforementioned abuse filter has been deployed. —&nbsp;<span style="font-variant: small-caps">[[User:Arcversin|Arcversin]] ([[User talk:Arcversin|talk]])</span> 01:14, 19 April 2022 (UTC)
:Hey there, I understand that it may be frustrating to you that you aren't getting a chance to be a system administrator, but this isn't the case for you alone. @[[User:Justarandomamerican|Justarandomamerican]] had his request for stewardship denied once and withdrawn also.@[[User:LisafBia|LisafBia]] also had their request denied.I suggest you mingle with the community and try to spend more time here.Then, if you gain a fair position in the community, I will nominate you myself. [[User:TheAstorPastor|<span style="font-family:Segoe print; color:#8B0000; text-shadow:gray 0.2em 0.2em 0.4em;">The AP </span>]] ([[User talk:TheAstorPastor|<span style="font-family:Segoe print; color:#AA336A">''talk''</span>]]) 06:31, 3 June 2024 (UTC)


== Lift protection on [[MediaWiki:Common.css]] ==
===Questions for the candidate===
 
<div class="boilerplate metadata discussion-archived" style="background-color: #F2F4FC; margin: 2em 0 0 0; padding: 0 10px 0 10px; border: 1px solid #aaa">
:''The following discussion is closed. <b style="color:red">Please do not modify it</b>. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section.''
::{{Done|[[Special:Redirect/logid/31337|Done, at least temporarily]]}}, [[User:Arcversin|Arcversin]] et al., chiefly since [[Test Wiki:Interface administrators|interface administrator]] granting and revocation has since been restricted to Stewards for mainly security purposes, but ''do'' note we reserve the right to reinstate [[Test Wiki:Stewards|Steward]] protection for this high impact CSS interface page depending on if [[w:WP:BEANS|BEANSey]] things happen. [[User:Dmehus|Dmehus]] ([[User talk:Dmehus|talk]]) 02:59, 25 April 2022 (UTC)
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Could the steward-only create protection on [[MediaWiki:Common.css]] be removed? I'm trying to deploy some styles to get the {{tl|mbox}} series of templates properly working. —&nbsp;<span style="font-variant: small-caps">[[User:Arcversin|Arcversin]] ([[User talk:Arcversin|talk]])</span> 01:11, 19 April 2022 (UTC)
: {{Support}}. I also thought the other day I was going to work with styles, but it was blocked. — Regards, [[U:Kazrok4545|<span style="font-family:comic sans ms ;color:Blue;">'''''Kazrok4545'''''</span>]] [[UT:Kazrok4545|<span style="font-family:comic sans ms ;color:Blue;">'''''<small>Talk</small>'''''</span>]] 13:44, 19 April 2022 (UTC)
: {{Support}} I think the limitations on the MediaWiki:common page are; must be granted bureaucrat permits [[User:LisafBia|LisafBia]] ([[User talk:LisafBia|talk]]) 09:18, 20 April 2022 (UTC)
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:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive. <b style="color:red">Please do not modify it</b>. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section.'' </div>
 
== [[Special:AbuseFilter/89|Filter 89]] ==
Looks like we're getting a few false positives here; I fixed a typo on an AbuseFilter warning and apparently I was disallowed. See [https://testwiki.wiki/wiki/Special:AbuseLog?wptarget=3PPYB6 my abuse log] for reference.
 
@[[User:Kazrok4545|Kazrok4545]]—Courtesy ping if you have ideas. Thanks. —[[User:3PPYB6|3PPYB6]] ([[User talk:3PPYB6|talk]]) 16:09, 19 April 2022 (UTC)
:This is the result of the filter filtering for the <code><nowiki><br></nowiki></code> tag, which is a very common indicator of spam. This is actually unnecessary (already in another filter), so I've removed it and extended the exempted groups. {{ping|Kazrok4545}} I've temporarily disabled the filter pending clarification on its intent, were you intending to do something akin to [[Special:AbuseFilter/88|filter 88]], or was this intended to be an addition to [[Special:AbuseFilter/52|filter 52]]? —&nbsp;<span style="font-variant: small-caps">[[User:Arcversin|Arcversin]] ([[User talk:Arcversin|talk]])</span> 20:30, 19 April 2022 (UTC)
::Sorry, I forgot to switch off this filter. It was created for testing. It is advisable to add these words to filter 52. — Regards, [[U:Kazrok4545|<span style="font-family:comic sans ms ;color:Blue;">'''''Kazrok4545'''''</span>]] [[UT:Kazrok4545|<span style="font-family:comic sans ms ;color:Blue;">'''''<small>Talk</small>'''''</span>]] 12:34, 20 April 2022 (UTC)
 
== Rename Account ==
 
Hi,
 
Could you please rename my account Videojeux4 to HeartsDo, please.
 
(Proof: [https://meta.miraheze.org/wiki/User:HeartsDo here]) [[User:Videojeux4|Videojeux4]] ([[User talk:Videojeux4|talk]]) 04:41, 20 April 2022 (UTC)
:Pinging {{Ping|Dmehus}} {{Ping|MacFan4000}} [[User:AlPaD|AlPaD]] ([[User talk:AlPaD|talk]]) 05:51, 20 April 2022 (UTC)
:[[User:Videojeux4|HeartsDo]], though I don't likely doubt this to be you, would you mind confirming your Test Wiki account from your Miraheze account? Thanks. [[User:Dmehus|Dmehus]] ([[User talk:Dmehus|talk]]) 02:49, 25 April 2022 (UTC)
:I know the account to be legit. {{Done}}. [[User:MacFan4000|MacFan4000]] <sup>([[User talk:MacFan4000|Talk]] [[Special:Contributions/MacFan4000|Contribs]])</sup> 03:12, 26 April 2022 (UTC)
::Thanks! :p [[User:HeartsDo|HeartsDo]] ([[User talk:HeartsDo|talk]]) 16:41, 26 April 2022 (UTC)
 
== Block Request ==
 
Hello, I think it would be good if I took a break from here for a bit. Could someone please block me for a few days, like maybe until May 1? Thank you very much. [[User:Seiyena|Sei]] ([[Special:Contribs/Seiyena|<span style="color:red">My changes here</span>]] | [[Special:Newsection/User talk:Seiyena|<span style="color:#0080ff">Drop me a line</span>]]) 09:34, 25 April 2022 (UTC)
:{{ping|Seiyena}} I am willing to give out the block, on condition that:
:# You agree not to evade your block using sockpuppets.
:# You agree to be hard-blocked (i.e. with autoblock enabled).
:[[User:NguoiDungKhongDinhDanh|NguoiDungKhongDinhDanh]] ([[User talk:NguoiDungKhongDinhDanh|talk]]) 10:51, 25 April 2022 (UTC)
::I agree to both conditions.[[User:Seiyena|Sei]] ([[Special:Contribs/Seiyena|<span style="color:red">My changes here</span>]] | [[Special:Newsection/User talk:Seiyena|<span style="color:#0080ff">Drop me a line</span>]]) 11:22, 25 April 2022 (UTC)
:::You have now been blocked. Enjoy your break. [[User:NguoiDungKhongDinhDanh|NguoiDungKhongDinhDanh]] ([[User talk:NguoiDungKhongDinhDanh|talk]]) 11:25, 25 April 2022 (UTC)
 
== Any thoughts on this proposed change to filter 88? ==
 
Right now filter 88 is set to simply disallow the action that is trying to be performed. Given the number of recent triggers to that filter, maybe that should be changed to instead issue a 3-day block any time the filter is triggered as well as remove from any special groups like admin or bureaucrat. I think that might make it more effective at its job and also not cause it to be triggered so much. This proposal would need a steward's help to implement if it's approved since it involves adding restricted actions. But I do think this might be beneficial to the target of the filter.
 
Any thoughts on whether this is a good or bad idea? [[User:Seiyena|Sei]] ([[Special:Contribs/Seiyena|<span style="color:red">My changes here</span>]] | [[Special:Newsection/User talk:Seiyena|<span style="color:#0080ff">Drop me a line</span>]]) 12:50, 29 April 2022 (UTC)
 
:I see no problem if there are at least two non-steward users who can modify that filter. [[:wikipedia:Oligarchy|Oligarchy]] is not really a nice way to work, especially in wikis. [[User:NguoiDungKhongDinhDanh|NguoiDungKhongDinhDanh]] ([[User talk:NguoiDungKhongDinhDanh|talk]]) 17:55, 29 April 2022 (UTC)
::Currently, filters with restricted actions (i.e. block, rangeblock, and degroup; though the later two aren't enabled at all here) can only be edited by Stewards. —&nbsp;<span style="font-variant: small-caps">[[User:Arcversin|Arcversin]] ([[User talk:Arcversin|talk]])</span> 15:08, 30 April 2022 (UTC)
:::I know. I'm waiting for [[Test Wiki:Community portal/06#Filter #52|this]]. [[User:NguoiDungKhongDinhDanh|NguoiDungKhongDinhDanh]] ([[User talk:NguoiDungKhongDinhDanh|talk]]) 20:25, 30 April 2022 (UTC)
 
== Name Change Request ==
 
Hi, can I please get my name changed to Bastrop? Thanks! [[User:Seiyena|Sei]] ([[Special:Contribs/Seiyena|<span style="color:red">My changes here</span>]] | [[Special:Newsection/User talk:Seiyena|<span style="color:#0080ff">Drop me a line</span>]]) 19:16, 30 April 2022 (UTC)
 
:{{ping|Seiyena}} Pings will only work if you add your signature in the same edit in which you add the ping. —&nbsp;<span style="font-variant: small-caps">[[User:Arcversin|Arcversin]] ([[User talk:Arcversin|talk]])</span> 13:39, 1 May 2022 (UTC)
 
Now I realize I messed up the ping yet again lol. Trying this again. {{ping|MacFan4000}} or {{ping|Dmehus}} Thanks! [[User:Seiyena|Sei]] ([[Special:Contribs/Seiyena|<span style="color:red">My changes here</span>]] | [[Special:Newsection/User talk:Seiyena|<span style="color:#0080ff">Drop me a line</span>]]) 08:49, 2 May 2022 (UTC)
 
== Proposed amendment to [[Test Wiki:Bots]] ==
 
=== Proposal ===
It is proposed that [[Test Wiki:Bots]] be amended [[Special:Diff/22074|as described]] at [[Test Wiki:Bots|the policy page]]. The <code>bot</code> flag [[rfc:2119|'''must not''']] be granted by [[Test Wiki:Stewards|non-test administrators]] on Test Wiki permanently. Requests for permanent/indefinite <code>bot</code> flags [[rfc:2119|''should'']] be made at [[Test Wiki:Bot approval requests]]. Requests should articulate the described particulars, at minimum. Bureaucrats may grant themselves the <code>bot</code> temporarily, for no more than twenty-four (24) hours, provided they state a clear and valid reason in their log summary. [[User:Dmehus|Dmehus]] ([[User talk:Dmehus|talk]]) 23:04, 1 May 2022 (UTC)
 
'''Rationale:'''
* Provides for consistent approval of indefinitely/permanently-granted <code>bot</code> flags;
* Ensures bureaucrats and administrators are transparently disclosing all edits and log actions; and,
* Provides overall clarity.
 
==== Support ====
*{{Support}} I agree with it. <del>Though I don't oppose it, [[#Counter-proposal]] seems bit complicated to me.</del>
**Still, I'm confused about 1 sentence. "The bot flag '''must not''' be granted by '''non-test administrators''' on Test Wiki permanently". "non-test administrators" means steward, correct? Must '''not''' steward grant permanent bot flag? I'm not good at English, so I may have mistranslated that(I'm terribly sorry if so), but could you recheck that sentence, please?--[[User:Q8j|Q8j]] ([[User talk:Q8j|talk]]) 08:00, 2 May 2022 (UTC) <small>Modify. On second thought.--[[User:Q8j|Q8j]] ([[User talk:Q8j|talk]]) 09:32, 2 May 2022 (UTC)</small>
*{{Support}} Per nom. [[User:I_am_One|I am one]] ([[User_talk:I_am_One|as you are three]]) 12:40, 2 May 2022 (UTC)
 
==== Neutral/Abstain ====
 
 
==== Oppose ====
* {{Oppose}} –[[User:CrazyFisherman|CrazyFisherman]] ([[User talk:CrazyFisherman|talk]]) 20:00, 10 May 2022 (UTC) isn't necessary at all
 
=== Counter-proposal ===
As an alternative to the above primary proposal, the primary proposal is adopted ''except'' the <code>bot</code> flag is restricted technically to being granted by [[Test Wiki:Stewards|stewards]] and a new <code>[[Test Wiki:Pseudobots|pseudobot]]</code> or <code>[[Test Wiki:Flooders|flood]]</code> group is created for temporary uses, which may be granted by bureaucrats along the same terms as the primary propose. [[User:Dmehus|Dmehus]] ([[User talk:Dmehus|talk]]) 23:05, 1 May 2022 (UTC)
 
'''Note:''' It is possible for you to support both the primary and counter-proposals and for both to pass.
 
==== Support ====
* {{support}} creation of the <code>flood</code> user group and {{oppose}} restricting the <code>bot</code> group to steward-only. However, I also {{support}} <em>disallowing</em> bureaucrats from granting themself <code>bot</code> (or <code>flood</code>) indefinitely unless they promises to revoke it after a short while (less than 24 hours, after which another crat may revoke the flag(s)). [[User:NguoiDungKhongDinhDanh|NguoiDungKhongDinhDanh]] ([[User talk:NguoiDungKhongDinhDanh|talk]]) 03:40, 2 May 2022 (UTC)
*: By the way, presuming <code>flood</code> consists of only one rights, <code>bot</code>, an admin-flooder will be able to do everything a bot can, apart from preventing notification when marking an edit as minor (<code>minornotalk</code>). [[User:NguoiDungKhongDinhDanh|NguoiDungKhongDinhDanh]] ([[User talk:NguoiDungKhongDinhDanh|talk]]) 03:46, 2 May 2022 (UTC)
*{{Support}} As Public TestWiki. [[User:AlPaD|AlPaD]] ([[User talk:AlPaD|talk]]) 14:31, 10 May 2022 (UTC)
 
==== Neutral/Abstain ====
{{Neutral}} [[User:LisafBia|LisafBia]] ([[User talk:LisafBia|talk]]) 11:14, 5 May 2022 (UTC)
 
{{Neutral}} --[[User:想舞花|想舞花]] ([[User talk:想舞花|talk]]) 05:53, 6 May 2022 (UTC)
 
{{Neutral}} — Regards, [[U:Kazrok4545|<span style="font-family:comic sans ms ;color:Blue;">'''''Kazrok4545'''''</span>]] [[UT:Kazrok4545|<span style="font-family:comic sans ms ;color:Blue;">'''''<small>Talk</small>'''''</span>]] 13:12, 6 May 2022 (UTC)
 
{{Neutral}} - Although complicated and long winded, I do prefer and agree with [[#Counter-proposal]]. [[User:Trayfel|Trayfel]] • ([[Special:Contribs/Trayfel|<span style="color:#0080ff"> Edits</span>]] | [[Special:Newsection/User talk:Trayfel|<span style="color:#0080ff">Talk </span>]]) 10:42, 7 May 2022 (UTC)
 
==== Oppose ====
* {{Oppose}} –[[User:CrazyFisherman|CrazyFisherman]] ([[User talk:CrazyFisherman|talk]]) 20:00, 10 May 2022 (UTC) per abvoe
 
=== General comments ===
 
== Stewardship request ==
 
Hello, I'm LisafBia. Most butlers have jobs on other wikis and can't help. I think I'm active on this wiki and I think I can help. Please choose me steward! [[User:LisafBia|LisafBia]] ([[User talk:LisafBia|talk]]) 19:08, 22 May 2022 (UTC)
==== Support ====
*It would be great to have a more active steward here, and you seem to do a good job here. [[User:Seiyena|Sei]] ([[Special:Contribs/Seiyena|<span style="color:red">My changes here</span>]] | [[Special:Newsection/User talk:Seiyena|<span style="color:#0080ff">Drop me a line</span>]]) 17:50, 23 May 2022 (UTC)
 
==== Oppose ====
*In [[Test Wiki:Request permissions/Archive10]], you handled request requested by Seiyena twice.
**[[Special:PermaLink/22496#Seiyena_2|#Seiyena_2]], you granted her BC despite that I had put that on hold. My reason for putting it on hold is as Trayfel said. If you had checked her permissions log in advance, you could have noticed that it's prohibited by steward. And if you had asked me before, I would have answer the reason.
**[[Special:PermaLink/22496#Seiyena_8|#Seiyena_8]], you granted admin again despite steward's prohibition.
*Considering these facts, I have to conclude you used permission carelessly. Thus, I can't support this - not yet, at least. Sorry.
*Also, although I don't think you're obliged to do that, I expect steward to enable 2FA.--[[User:Q8j|Q8j]] ([[User talk:Q8j|talk]]) 10:30, 23 May 2022 (UTC)
 
:To be honest, I wouldn't hold those two incidents against them. I know that when I myself grant rights on the Miraheze test wiki, I never think to check the past log entries. It just never crosses my mind to do that. [[User:Seiyena|Sei]] ([[Special:Contribs/Seiyena|<span style="color:red">My changes here</span>]] | [[Special:Newsection/User talk:Seiyena|<span style="color:#0080ff">Drop me a line</span>]]) 17:50, 23 May 2022 (UTC)
==== Neutral ====
{{Neutral}} I don't know what's going on.

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UserRightsManager

Latest comment: Yesterday at 13:011 comment1 person in discussion

The name of the userRightsManager gadget has changed, so some users may have the tick turned off. It may be necessary to re-enable it in the preferences. LisafBia (talk) 13:01, 1 June 2024 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Systemadministrator

Latest comment: 06:3128 comments8 people in discussion

@MacFan4000: I would want to say that LisafBia, the two stewards (Drummingman and Justarandomamerican), and I, indicate that I voted, and all votes are oppose (formerly my vote was a neutral, but changed to oppose regarding most people's concerns). MacFan4000, you may have to close as unsuccessful. @Justman10000: If you have any further questions regarding this or want to vote on yourself, please state your questions below the votes in the "Questions by the candidate" section or take place of your vote here before MacFan4000 is closing it. Tailsultimatefan3891 (talk) 20:26, 2 June 2024 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I would like to be a system administrator so that I can also support at system configuration level... In addition to managing permissions, I would also keep the software, extensions and skins up to date and optimise the configurations!

It would be really nice to get a chance 🙂 Justman10000 (talk) 16:28, 2 June 2024 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Did you know how to use Git, PHP, and SSH, and you are active on this wiki? Please see Project:System administrators. Also, it would be really nice for you to be a system administrator if you know understanding of Apache and a server (MariaDB/MySQL/PostgreSQL/SQLite). Tailsultimatefan3891 (talk) 17:00, 2 June 2024 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I already work with Linux Debian since 4 years! So yes 🙂 Justman10000 (talk) 17:03, 2 June 2024 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Are you aware that this very high trust permission can cause great damage if it's improperly used? Codename Noreste 🤔 La Suma 17:05, 2 June 2024 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I am aware of this! Yes Justman10000 (talk) 17:16, 2 June 2024 (UTC)Reply[reply]
So, voting by the two stewards and by some users is required. If the votes are successful, then it goes to the system administrator to grant the permission or not. Tailsultimatefan3891 (talk) 17:20, 2 June 2024 (UTC)Reply[reply]
The votes are all oppose that it is likely to be unsuccessful. Tailsultimatefan3891 (talk) 20:41, 2 June 2024 (UTC) (sorry for the late signing)Reply[reply]

Voting

Support

Oppose

  •   Weak Oppose Hi, thanks for volunteering. Unfortunately, I must weakly oppose your request at this time due to lack of necessary trust or track record. I do not think you would take the site down, abuse your power in some other way, or go inactive suddenly, but you do not hold Stewardship here or administratorship elsewhere, and you don't have that long of a track record, so I cannot be sure. Consider this a moral support of sorts; I have no objection to another run in the medium-term future. Justarandomamerican (talk) 17:32, 2 June 2024 (UTC)Reply[reply]
    Like I said, I'd be happy to get a chance, and if you don't think I would abuse my power (which I wouldn't too), then what's the problem? Justman10000 (talk) 17:44, 2 June 2024 (UTC)Reply[reply]
    This permission is very powerful, can lock the database and have access to PHP, SSH, Git, and Github and even Apache and the server (MariaDB/MySQL/PostgreSQL/SQLite). Tailsultimatefan3891 (talk) 17:47, 2 June 2024 (UTC)Reply[reply]
    System administratorship is a very powerful position. I prefer to err on the side of caution. Can you describe your previous experience with FiveM and Minecraft servers? Do you have PHP experience? Justarandomamerican (talk) 17:48, 2 June 2024 (UTC)Reply[reply]
    For the networks, I installed and configured web applications and Minecraft plugins Justman10000 (talk) 17:52, 2 June 2024 (UTC)Reply[reply]
    Please refer to the following questions:
    • Do you have PHP experience?
    • Do you have SSH experience?
    • Do you have Git/Github experience?
    • To make it easier, it is recommended to use MariaDB, MySQL, SQLite, or PostgreSQL server and use Apache. Do you have experience and understanding of that?
    Tailsultimatefan3891 (talk) 01:06, 3 June 2024 (UTC)Reply[reply]
    • Yes
    • Yes
    • Yes
    • I have already used all of the mentioned database systems early, so... yes
    Justman10000 (talk) 05:08, 3 June 2024 (UTC)Reply[reply]
  •   Oppose Hi, nice that you signed up and want to get more involved, I can only appreciate that. But unfortunately, here and for this reason, I want to cast my dissenting vote. I am very reluctant to assign this role to someone I don't know well. Anyway, are you already a system administrator, steward or admin on a major wiki project somewhere? On a Wikimedia, Miraheze or other large wikifarm. On these wikis, you become one only after a thorough review and vote. To me, that is a hard requirement for a system administrator. SA has the unlimited power to shut down an entire wiki (database lock and unlock) block anyone and deny or grant anyone user rights. Therefore, this right can only be granted to highly trusted users. Of course, this is separate from the technical side, which is also important. Drummingman (talk) 17:48, 2 June 2024 (UTC)Reply[reply]
    Of course, yes, I agree. I absolutely vote and agree on   Oppose but I gave the very strong oppose, biggest, strongest, ever. Tailsultimatefan3891 (talk) 01:13, 3 June 2024 (UTC)Reply[reply]
  •   Strongly oppose It doesn't make much sense to give a user who has been a member for less than 1 month a higher level of authority than even the stewards such as the system administrator. You need to have 3 or more months of activity history. LisafBia (talk) 18:14, 2 June 2024 (UTC)Reply[reply]
    Nowhere does it say anything about that... So... And is it so difficult to give someone a chance? It's not really motivating Justman10000 (talk) 18:25, 2 June 2024 (UTC)Reply[reply]
    See what the text LisafBia and the 2 stewards said, plus the vote from me right below. Not satisfying and broken trust. Tailsultimatefan3891 (talk) 20:31, 2 June 2024 (UTC)Reply[reply]
  •   Strongly, very strong, extreme, intense, super, mega, kilo, peta, peta, tera, tera, mega, mega, very strong, strongly, bigger, longer, and absolute oppose that is the biggest, longest, and strongest oppose that I will ever give Seriously?!? This user has no long history, new to this wiki, despite knowing PHP, SSH, and Git and needs more experience with Apache and a server (PostgreSQL, MariaDB, MySQL, SQLite). System administrator is a very powerful right, even more than interface administrator and especially intended to be more powerful than regular stewards, including grant or revocate anyone user rights, disable OAuth for a user, locking the database and have access to PHP, site-sensitive files, SSH, and Git as well as the server such as MySQL, MariaDB, PostgreSQL, and SQLite and Apache. They'll have access to DefaultSettings.php, LocalSettings.php, and NoLocalSettings.php. This right is extremely powerful. I hope this will be absolutely rejected. You'll hear no complaints from me. Tailsultimatefan3891 (talk) 20:21, 2 June 2024 (UTC)Reply[reply]
  •   Strong oppose per Drummingman and Justarandomamerican; Justaman10000 joined on test wiki sice 28 May 2024 (7 days) and I don't think they are really eligible for system administrator privileges for at this time and I don't think they are currently fulfill system admin's requirements. Happy testing ~~ínfínítу • [@píng mє] 03:38, 3 June 2024 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Neutral

Comments

Questions by the candidate

What is actually so damn hard to understand about the sentence, It would be really nice to get a chance? If you're only ever rejected, there comes a day when you don't want to do anything anywhere! Just give it a damn chance and let someone prove themselves... Is that so hard?

It is the unlimited power, yes! But that way I could have proved myself directly! It's extremely unmotivating to first have to do what I know how many weeks or even months of preparatory work, only to probably be rejected again! --Justman10000 (talk) 05:06, 3 June 2024 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Hey there, I understand that it may be frustrating to you that you aren't getting a chance to be a system administrator, but this isn't the case for you alone. @Justarandomamerican had his request for stewardship denied once and withdrawn also.@LisafBia also had their request denied.I suggest you mingle with the community and try to spend more time here.Then, if you gain a fair position in the community, I will nominate you myself. The AP (talk) 06:31, 3 June 2024 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Questions for the candidate

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