User talk:Proof

Unblock request

This drama ends now, if you would like to make an actual unblock request please do so in a new section. Fast - ZoomZoom (talk) 17:59, 7 January 2021 (UTC)
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section.
@Naleksuh: As Naleksuh requested I am using my original account as to not be considered a "sock" account. Why is my material being hidden? And why is everyone just staying silent about (redacted) being homophobic and not blocking him? Does this wiki really tolerate homophobic users? That's insane, it's a hate crime. Could some please just explain the logic behind not blocking (redacted) (a homophobic person with irrefutable evidence to back that up) but hiding my revisions, when all I've done is show proof that (redacted) is homophobic? I just want to understand honestly, I've not insulted anyone on this wiki and I will not do so as my only purpose is to expose (redacted) for who he is: a unapologetic homophobe. He can't just get away with that he's hurt a immeasurable amount of people with his homophobic statements and it has to stop. If he doesn't get block he will just think it is okay to be homophobic and IT IS NOT. Proof (talk) 08:23, 6 January 2021 (UTC) Also if another admin other than Naleksuh reads this, please don't delete it, let him read it please. Proof (talk) 08:24, 6 January 2021 (UTC) @Q8j: This user appears to have requested unblock from their original account, so why have you revision deleted their request and pulled talk page access? I do not see any evidence of block evasion when they were requesting from their original account and the original blocking sysop had talk page access enabled. Naleksuh (talk) 19:28, 6 January 2021 (UTC) @Naleksuh:his(her) opinion above((redacted) being...) is repeated many times with his sockpuppets, and most(all?) of them are hidden. I thought it can be libel/personal attack, and therefore hid that.--Q8j (talk) 20:14, 6 January 2021 (UTC) I for one have not investigated the validity of the user's claims, I was simply procedurally blocking them for block evasion. If they are indeed requesting from their original account, I would see no problem with them requesting unblock. Naleksuh (talk) 20:26, 6 January 2021 (UTC) Yes, I agree blocked user can request for unblock from their original talk page. But I thought the comment above is just attack under the guise of "unblock request".Q8j (talk) 20:34, 6 January 2021 (UTC) This does not appear to be a valid unblock request. Indeed as worded it suggests the exact opposite, that an indefinate Community Exile is the best path forward for all parties as nothing in the request nor your history thus far clearly evinces a desire to either conduct any testing yourself nor to facilitating testing for others, and you obviously have no intention of ever becoming a Community Member. Indeed for Online Communities in general and wikis in particular, people whose personal agendas and actions appear to be unrelated to the communities purpose are always at risk of having their privilege to contribute removed. Please understand that, as long as you continue to create sockpuppets for the sole purpose of hurling accusations of misbehavior/launching personal attacks/casting aspersions upon other users, that all of your edits will be reverted, all of the pages you create will be deleted, all of your accounts will be blocked, and it will take a local sysop all of 60 seconds to accomplish this (admittedly boring) task, while you waste much more of your own time to make the mess in the first place. No respectable wiki will block people because a random person on the internet attacks them with claims that they are racist, homophobic, or have some other personality defects. Blocks will only be issued if contributors demonstrate that behavior on the wiki, and none of our currently active contributors have such problems, or if there is strong evidence of extensive off-wiki harassment or similar undesirable behavior directed towards other users that threatens the integrity of the project, and no something that anyone can photoshop about anyone else does not count. If you do in fact poses solid evidence of a local contributor harassing others off-wiki, you may submit it in private via staff@testwiki.wiki. Also as a word to the wise, while there is no local policy saying that the user talk pages of blocked users must only be used for requesting unblocks. Access to them may be revoked if disruptive editing occurs just as it would for any other pages, and yes repeated improperly evidenced accusations leveled by name against other contributors are disruptive. If talk page access is revoked any future appeal would also need to occur via e-mail. And just so things are clear, none of this has nothing to do with you personally, it's just a standard WikiPattern, and you are free to leave at anytime. Regards, Fast - ZoomZoom (talk) 01:34, 7 January 2021 (UTC) @Fast: I can confirm that Cocopuff2018 has made comments in #wikipedia-en that were seen by others as homophobic and was banned by a channel operator due to it. However, if User:Proof wants to raise a concern about User:Cocopuff2018, they can do so without sockpuppetry as that will certainly not be taken seriously. Naleksuh (talk) 07:21, 7 January 2021 (UTC) Thank you, Naleksuh for defending me and allowing me to make my claims as well as acknowledging the truth about Cocopuff2018's behavior in #wikipedia-en. I will ping @Justarandomamerican: so that he can also see that I am not a crazy person and that another user has confirmed the truth. I am aware that my actions on this wiki are not very appropriate and I admit that I am not necessarily here for testing purposes, instead I am here to prevent a user who harasses, offends and insults others from being part of an otherwise decent, respectable and otherwise welcoming community. Regarding this statement "No respectable wiki will block people because a random person on the internet attacks them with claims that they are racist, homophobic, or have some other personality defects", I do concede that I am a "random person" but Naleksuh (a not random person!) has just confirmed that Cocopuff2018 has made homophobic comments, do you really find it so absurd that he would do so via a Discord direct message? I can assure you I do not even have Photoshop or any photo editing software and I have honestly never used such a program. Cocopuff has harmed people as I have said before. Besides that, he has his own wiki where he can test admin tools all he wants. Why allow someone who causes drama everywhere he goes and who deeply offends people of different sexual orientation than him to keep being part of this wiki when he doesn't even need it to test administrator tools? I again think that the best way to move forward is to prevent Cocopuff2018 from editing on this wiki due to the overwhelming evidence. Lastly, a kind editor who has been harassed a few months ago by Cocopuff and understandably does not wish to be named has provided me with more evidence. Due to my block here I am unable to upload it to this wiki, and for that reason you may access it <link prevented due to abusefilter> via this image hosting website. I would point you to Coco's personally hosted wiki where its uploaded but I fear he will soon delete it as it does not look good for him at all considering his pattern of homophobic statements. Thank you for your time, and I again must apologize for the way that I approached this and the spam, it was misplaced anger. I also promise you that if my case is heard out correctly and sanctions are applied to Cocopuff2018 you will never see me again around here with any account. Proof (talk) 10:13, 7 January 2021 (UTC) My pronouns are they/them, I do not use he/him pronouns anywhere. It sounds crazy that I have to tell a user who is making accusations of homophobia my pronouns. Justarandomamerican (talk) 10:32, 7 January 2021 (UTC) @Proof: Also "statements that were seen by others to be homophobic" doesn't confirm much. If you have any evidence, email it to System Administrators at staff@testwiki.wiki. Justarandomamerican (talk) 10:39, 7 January 2021 (UTC) @Justarandomamerican: I am not sure if you are part of the staff email, but I will repeat my apology to you here: "Firstly, I would like to start by wholeheartedly and deeply apologizing to Justarandomamerican for accidentally using the wrong pronouns when pinging them. It is a terrible habit and I did not read my text a second time in order to realize my grave mistake. It was an extremely half-witted mishap especially since my accusations concern homophobia.". In addition, I am happy to paste my email somewhere if you are not part of it but would like to read it. Proof (talk) 13:05, 7 January 2021 (UTC) @Naleksuh: @Justarandomamerican: @Fast: I Just got the ping, I am going to mention this user has been Creating many accounts on my wiki Promoting hate and Calling me "Homophobic, i in fact am not One and is was a misunderstanding i am not a homophobic when I was on the irc channel I was meaning to ask a Question and everyone took it the wrong way i have nothing against sexuality, and action on irc has been taken this is clearly off wiki drama on top of that this user has spammed and made multiple templated promoting and attacking that i will link below, anyways i personally thing this persons are questionable, i mean yes he could of handled it better instead of using Sockpuppet's and I would say I am inclined to Support a Unban As for multiple Reasons a) Not hear to test or make edits (b) attacks and Multiple Sockpuppet's i Can go on with more but for now i will keep it brief, as with this all being said i am not a homophobic it was a misunderstanding I would never say anything Hurtful Against Lgbt this user has also Recently created multiple Sockpuppet's this morning including the one's i will list from the last week, along with this user abusing a proxy to harass and attack me i do feel i should not be removed from test wiki or blocked as this clearly does seem this users behavior is warrant for Looking into on multiple Attacks, along with the user quote "i will never leave this wiki meaning he will not stop making accounts this has been going on now for a week and i do feel no action here should be taken on me as this was a honest mistake that i have made and i should be dismissed and forgiven for as it will not happen again as for the discord screenshot i never said that clearly that user could of Edited, Modified, or make an account pretending to be me to make me look bad, However i am going to be linking the rest of His Outrages behavior on sockpuppet's below along with many other accounts spamming, and Removing templates, this user has also shown no respect towards test wiki nor respect towards me or my fellow collages aswell, i am now requesting that this Issue is dismissed and that No action is taken upon me here as this clearly has no warrant for action within this wiki, and that i can remain as admin here, i also have use for my admin here and should not be Questioned by a troll who clearly harassed and insulted me in such a poor way, if anything Proof should remain Infintie blocked, I did want to point out According to Our code of conduct on Cocopuff wiki he has Broken multiple times and broke many of the Rules within the Wiki, and of course proof has also proken wiki Policies here along with using a proxy --Cocopuff2018 (talk) 14:57, 7 January 2021 (UTC) http://neko.kazdel.com/index.php/Special:Contributions/Im_never_leaving_and_i_will_defend_the_world_against_cocos_homophobia_and_racism http://neko.kazdel.com/index.php?title=User:I_will_not_spam_or_anything_today_so_I_can_show_you_more_proof&action=edit&redlink=1 http://neko.kazdel.com/index.php/User:I_can_fight_homophobia_all_day_pathetic_coconvt http://neko.kazdel.com/index.php/User:Im_never_leaving_and_i_will_defend_the_world_against_cocos_homophobia_and_racism http://neko.kazdel.com/index.php/User:Delete_this_wiki_pathetic_coconvt http://neko.kazdel.com/index.php/User:You_thought_id_take_a_break_but_no_sir_im_back_to_fight_homophobia http://neko.kazdel.com/index.php/User:You_can_never_stop_me_you_stupid_Coconut_until_you_delete_this_stupid_wiki @Cocopuff2018: You seem to be concentrating quite a lot on me rather than explaining yourself. Yes, I should have acted differently, yes my ways were not appropriate, but that doesn't excuse you from your homophobic comments. "I was meaning to ask a Question" this is just simply no way you were just asking a question, no way that is nonsense. You were clearly complaining about LGBT people and you know it. This is not your first time either, what do you say about the messages you sent people about the LGBT community on Discord? What about that time you removed someone's userbox on one of your wikis just because it said they were LGBT? Are you going to say that's not homophobia but just a misunderstanding? The definition of homophobia is "Homophobia encompasses a range of negative attitudes and feelings toward homosexuality or people who are identified or perceived as being lesbian, gay, bisexual or transgender (LGBT)." and your actions fit perfectly into this definition. It is painfully obvious that you are homophobic and that you do not like people who are not cisgender and that is just not acceptable in 2021, it is insulting and demeaning. So don't be so busy talking about my behavior when yours is so many times worse, and no, I don't respect you, since you don't respect a whole community of people. Also, do you not find it narcissistic to have call your wiki by your name "Cocopuff Wiki" as if you are it's supreme leader? It's not like Wikipedia is called "Jimbo Wales Wiki" is it? My advice to you is simple: grow up and get these homophobic ideas out of your brain! Proof (talk) 16:11, 7 January 2021 (UTC) Also, you cannot just dismiss this as being "off-wiki drama". Does that make it less valid? Does that mean you should just be allowed to get away with making homophobic statements? No. You are responsible for your actions. Proof (talk) 16:14, 7 January 2021 (UTC) @Proof: your gonna eventually give up on sockpuppeting my wiki, When will you ever give up, and what good does sockpuppeting my wiki do for you Because every sockpuppet you make on my wiki we will block it?? and also when will you stop messing up my templates they are important and your screwing them up?? --Cocopuff2018 (talk) 16:30, 7 January 2021 (UTC) and your responsible for your actions of sockpuppeting my wiki you will give up eventually and you will be blocked every time but attacking me is unacceptable and Harassments also cocopuff wiki is my wiki --Cocopuff2018 (talk) 16:36, 7 January 2021 (UTC) @Cocopuff2018: Are you serious? Are you not even going to bother denying the homophobic comments? Not denying them is as good as saying "Yes I did it". And yes, I am responsible, I have taken responsibility for my actions. You on the other hand either deny the accusations or refuse to confront them because you know if you admit to homophobia you will be blocked. And yes, I know Cocopuff Wiki is your wiki, I'm not stupid, but what I meant is it's narcissistic to call it by your username, who else calls their wikis by that? This wiki isn't called "Naleksuh Wiki" is it? It's childish to call your wiki by your name really. But that doesn't matter, what matters is that you refuse to deny the accusations because you know they're true. The reason why (in the past) I have created multiple accounts on your wiki was simply to condemn your vile homophobic behavior which you refuse to take responsibility for. You really just need to grow up, man. Proof (talk) 16:42, 7 January 2021 (UTC) Also I'm not saying I am a saint or I am perfect; I have done some bad things too, but I am proud to say I have never made homophobic comments and will never do so because that is just a disgraceful and disgusting thing to do frankly. Proof (talk) 16:44, 7 January 2021 (UTC) Say the inmuture idiot still socking my wiki with accounts plus you cannot even make Mass accounts for 5 minutes without getting blocked, your not even doing anything with your Spam accounts and that makes it easier on me as mentioned before you will eventually give up on Sockpuppeting my wiki i guarantee it and we will be ready for when you come and i did take action for my actions this does not concern you and if you keep harassing me i will report you to wikipedia for harassement and sockpuppeting my wiki --Cocopuff2018 (talk) 16:51, 7 January 2021 (UTC)

Advice

Bottom line first: Since your complaint concerns only off-wiki conduct, evidence should be analyzed and assessed off-wiki via e-mail or other appropriate channel and not on this page.

The general WikiPattern when user conduct needs to be scrutinized is that evidence involving on-wiki actions should be presented on-wiki, and evidence involving off-wiki conduct should be presented off-wiki. There may be occasional exceptions to this pattern (e.g. when suppression is involved) but I see no reason for one in this specific case.

I don't know all the details, nor should I know them as I am not a local functionary. The decision made by the stewards will take into account the quality of the evidence as well as the totality of the circumstances including duration, recency, severity, and the conduct of other parties. What I can tell you is that a one-off comment made two years ago that some people took the wrong way will be treated differently than an ongoing pattern of harassment that hounded a contributor away from the community last week. And yes there is a lot of ground between those two positions, and no you should not try to explain where on that continuum exactly the current situation falls on this page. Until a decision has been made any editors whose edits here have not been disruptive will be treated as would any other editor in good-standing. Once the decision is made, accept the outcome whatever that may be, and move on.

On a semi-related tangent, creating a bunch of sockpuppets to disrupt a wiki however much you dislike it or its members is a waste of everyone's time, and more your time than theirs. You can read more at WhyWikiWorks but it's been pretty conclusively proven at this point that if there is one thing all active wikis have in spades it is people who will hunt down all (perceived) sources of disruption be it spammers, flamers, vandals, trolls, or just editors who they feel don't belong; undo their work, and either block them or find someone else who will. You could argue that people who are willing to do that all day, every day are just as weird and/or crazy as the people doing the disruption in the first place, but that doesn't change the fact that they exist. The way to actually handle a wiki that is hosting copyright infringing, illegal, or other grossly inappropriate content is to either contact the ISP's through their e-mail for handling abuse or in the case of a respectable wikifarm, to just contact the central authority responsible for managing all wikis. This may not be a permanent solution when employed against a particularly determined community (the many lives and deaths of ED come immediately to mind), but it will at least make life considerably more difficult for them and shift the time wasting dynamic to one that is in your favor.

On another note, (and without knowing all the details which I should not know), wikimedia has it's own well developed systems for handling abuse that occurs off-wiki on IRC or elsewhere, and they have far greater resources to analyze, verify, and authenticate off-wiki evidence than we do.

• For issues that are specific to the enWP you may e-mail private evidence to functionaries-en@lists.wikimedia.org
• Issues involving wikimedia assets more generally should have private evidence e-mailed to stewards@wikimedia.org
• If you find the volunteer response lacking you may always escalate to the WMF's paid professionals through ca@wikimedia.org

Be assured that in the case of a WMF global ban the likelihood of a reciprocal ban here is extremely high.

To close, appropriate uses of this page include:

• Requesting an unblock.
• Asking for advice or information in general terms, such as to where a complaint should be directed.
• Directing the attention of contributors to on-wiki information when done so as to further this wiki's purpose.

Inappropriate uses of this talk page include:

• Posting private off-wiki evidence which should be handled through the appropriate channels as mentioned above.
• Continuing feuds from other wikis.
• Drama.

Thanks for your understanding. Best, Fast - ZoomZoom (talk) 18:03, 7 January 2021 (UTC)

Per fasts comment I have restored talk page access although I would see no problem with it being re-moved if it continues. Naleksuh (talk) 08:03, 8 January 2021 (UTC)

For enwiki specific issues, email the arbitration committee at arbcom-en@wikimedia.org Justarandomamerican (talk) 22:10, 8 January 2021 (UTC)

Thank you, Q8j. I'm really sorry about this, genuinely, but it's mind-boggling that no one here cares that (redacted) is homophobic and has made numerous homophobic statements. Do you really want someone like him here? (PS "Fopor" is an anagram for "Proof") Also, if someone killed someone in Canada and then went to the US, would they not get arrested? (Redacted) has made homophobic comments on other wikis, that still makes him a homophobe and a bad person. I am requesting an unblock because I did nothing wrong except expose the truth. Proof (talk) 18:39, 9 January 2021 (UTC)

Comparing murder to getting an IRC channel ban is plain ludicrous. Justarandomamerican (talk) 19:37, 9 January 2021 (UTC)